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Message: <blockquote data-quote="FrogReaver" data-source="post: 8309650" data-attributes="member: 6795602">Saying cantrips aren't interesting isn't saying magic isn't interesting.  Minor effects aren't interesting in themselves.  It's about like calling a torch or a healing potion or caltrops or a spyglass 'interesting'.You might can do a few interesting things with minor illusion, but then I can do some interesting things with pretty much any mundane object in the game.5e exists as it exists.  All I'm saying is that we should approach it from that perspective instead of trying to change what it is via new classes.  I'm really not opposed to new classes and I think there's plenty of concepts we can create classes around that are unique compared to what is already in 5e.  There is plenty of room for more classes that would evoke a martial/leader feel, but it has to be something more than simply Martial Leader (which is really the whole theme the 4e Warlord was based on).I'm not even against the notion that martials could have gotten more or casters could have gotten less (though, that's a conceptual gap that will never be completely bridgeable in D&D).  If you want to see a class System I like, look at the Stars without Number system.  You get to pick between 3 classes or can pick 2 and have a hybrid class.  It covers all the ground you would need.  Psionics (aka magic) in it is very specific and toned down - meaning it can add a few tricks but is no where near as versatile or powerful as 5e magic.</blockquote>

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