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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ECMO3" data-source="post: 8319018" data-attributes="member: 7030563">The are supposed to have the "role" that the player wants them to have.And yes the Rogue as a class is a lot more restricted in combat.  A fighter can get a reach weapon and kite around just like a Rogue and have a better AC and more hps while doing it.  On the other hand a Rogue can't do what a fighter does in combat easily.Such a Rogue will  not keep up with a fighter who invests in his strength and will not be able to do as many things in combatHeavy Armor gives the fighter more AC and he has more hps too.Acrobatics is strictly inferior to athletics in combat because it can only be used defensively in combat and is less useful out of combat.  As a matter of fact I play a lot of Rogues and most of them have a strength of 8 and expertise in athletics because it is a better skill.  A Rogue who takes both acrobatics and athletics is going to be using 2 proficiencies on things that overlap.  A Rogue who does not take athletics can't climb worth a crap unless they boost strength. Rogues are my favorite class.  they are awesome, everything youn are saying here is true, but a Rogue who invests only in dex is not the equivalent in combat of a fighter who invests only in strength.You need to put points in strength to wear medium armor, carry a decent array of geat and not be encumbered.  Half plate is 40 lbs.A fighter can have a 21 at first level if he can find the money to afford plate.  The maximum a Rogue can have without a feat or a spell is 17 and with point buy he can't do that until 8th level and needs to put everything into dexterity ASIs to get there.  That is a pretty big difference between 17 and 21.Yeah the average Rogue, that isn't optimized for combat and isn't as good in combat.You are a ROGUE and you are not as good as fighting.  You are saying it yourself, over and over but you won't admit it.And like I said the fighter with a reach weapon doesn't have to go into melee either .... but he gets the advantage of being harder to hit with ready action by most foes because he is never within reach, and when they do get off a rare attack he has a better AC.</blockquote>

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