Spooney review 4e

[Gothmog]

I should also point out I give a number of bonus trained skills at character creation equal to a character's Int modifier. Those bonus skills can be used for any skills on the class list, or for skills not on the class list, but skills not on the class list of skills cost 2 choices to become trained in. So far its worked well, allowing the PCs to be more customized and variable.

 

[LostSoul]

It would seem that throwing sand in somebody's eyes and melting their face with a vision of the Far Realm should follow different mechanics, but with 4e, it's largely: "Damage + Blinded (for a while)."

That makes sense, and I can understand it.

I think the reason that the classes seem different to me is because I'm looking at what they are doing in the fiction - they all have the same ability to get to the same place (end the encounter), more or less, but how they get there is different.

I guess if you are looking for a difference in the metagame, you won't get it.

 

[Jack99]

Well, here is how I broke down the knowledge skills:

Arcana- used to ID spell effects, magic item ID, detect magic
Dungeoneering- used like Nature indoors, tracking underground, ID subterranean plants and animals, knowing about geology, underground foraging, etc
Nature- used for tracking, ID plants and animals, herbalism, foraging
Religion- used to know about your religion (+3 bonus) or other religions and their teachings, theology, symbolism, prophecies, etc

and the new ones:

Elemental Lore- recall info about elemenal creatures, including demons, and how the elemental planes react, elemental lore
Faerie Lore- used to recall fey legends, Feywild lore, events, creatures, and misc lore
Forbidden Lore- used to recall info about the Far Realm and its denizens (abberations)
Spirit Lore- used to recall info about the Shadowfell, spirit creatures who dwell there, etc
Supernal Lore- gives info about devils, angels, the gods, Astral Sea, etc
Undead Lore- used to ID undead, know common legends about the undead, and signs of undead activity



The classes that get these as class skills are:

Cleric: Arcana, Religion, Spirit Lore, Supernal Lore, Undead Lore
Fighter: None
Paladin: Religion, Supernal Lore
Ranger: Dungeoneering, Nature
Rogue: Dungeoneering
Warlock: Arcana, Religion and Faerie Lore, Forbidden Lore, or Supernal Lore- depending on type of pact
Warlord: None
Wizard: Arcana, Elemental Lore, Faerie Lore, Religion, Forbiddern Lore, Spirit Lore, Supernal Lore, Undead Lore

Thanks. I might yoink that.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Don't flatter yourself.
I came to this thread because it looked interesting.
The irony of your comment was simply beyond my will save.

Oh yeah, and breaking the rules by accusing me of trolling isn't cool dude.

(Other than that, you don't bother me. I'm having a good time )

So what makes you think you can ignore my instructions further up the thread?

You're banned for 3 days.

 

[ExploderWizard]

I think the review had a very human touch but yes, it was kind of a ramble that went all over the place.

The classes being the same thing has some degree of truth to it. Every class has basic bzzzt zap power, plus other bzzzt zap plus effect powers, making them seem the same in that regard. Classes in AD&D have a much different feel from each other. In original AD&D though, members of the same class would be identical with no way to customize at all apart from the generated ability scores.

Its the super emphasis on balance that leads to this "sameness" feel. To some this is a welcomed blessing and to others (such as myself) its an effect that comes with too high a price in gamist feel.

The comments toward the end regarding a sterile and safe feel hold a bit of truth for myself as well. I do disagree with his "its hard to die" comment though. My own experience with 4E is proof of that. The sterile and safe feelings I get from the rules have little to do with the danger levels of encounters at all. The feeling comes from a birds eye view of the whole system from power,creature, magic item, and encounter designs. Everything is so tightly knit together for balanced play and to avoid "game breaking" events that it feels too artificial. Some groups may enjoy the tight controlled rules but it seems too limiting and restrictive for our group.

 

[Alzrius]

I want to mention that, aside from the discussion regarding his review of 4E, I strongly encourage people to read his movie reviews (and watch the video game review videos). I'm a big fan of Spoony, and his writing and videos almost always make me laugh out loud. He's really a very funny guy.

For proof, I submit his written review of the movie The Wizard, and his video review of the Make My Video video games. If you can read/watch those and not fall over laughing, I'd be surprised.