Spring Attack and Hideous Blow/Shot on the Run and Eldritch Blast- possible!

[UltimaGabe]

Hey, everyone. Now, don't go and make big assumptions by the title of my post- I am well aware (and you all should be too) that there is no possible way to use an Eldritch Blast with Shot on the Run, and no way to use Hideous Blow with Spring Attack. (If you don't know why, it's because both of these feats require an attack action, and Eldritch Blast & Hideous Blow are Standard Actions, not attack actions.) However, I found a little way to gain the effects of both (more or less) with the expenditure of only one feat, rather than three (as with both of the Spring Attack & Shot on the Run), and you'd have to use up one of your Invocation slots on an Invocation you'd probably get anyway.

The first step is to, once you can, take the Fell Flight Invocation. This can't be gotten for quite some time (as I can't remember whether it's a Lesser of a Greater), but once you can, it grants you a Fly speed equal to your base speed, and lasts 24 hours. So it's pretty much always on.

Then, whip out your Monster Manual and take a look at the Fly-By Attack feat. It's a feat that lets you take a move action and a standard action, and use the standard action at any point during the move. The only prerequisite is a Fly speed.

Well, since you HAVE a Fly speed (and, just for reference, the PHB and the FAQ states that you can take a feat any time you qualify it, even if you're getting the prerequisites from a magic item or some other temporary source, but you lose the ability to use the feat whenever you fail to meet the prerequisites- so you'll always apply for this feat unless your Fell Flight gets Dispelled, in which case you can just use it again on your next turn), you now qualify for Fly-by Attack. Since it allows a Standard Action (rather than an attack action), you may use your Eldritch Blast in the middle of a Move, Hideous Blow in the middle of a move, or (if you somehow meet the prerequisites) you could even use Manyshot on a move- but you've gotta take lots and lots of levels in Warlock to do so.

So, what do you all think?

 

[Chorn]

Ingenious! It's also perfectly legal unless the DM won't allow feats from the Monster Manual. You just have to remember to keep flying while on ground since it only works when flying.

 

[DevoutlyApathetic]

It also doesn't stop you from provoking for the movement, not exactly spring attack though pretty close to Shot on the Run.

 

[iceifur]

It also doesn't stop you from provoking for the movement, not exactly spring attack though pretty close to Shot on the Run.

Yes, but isn't there a follow-up feat in the draconic feats section of the Draconomicon called something like "Adroit Flyby Attack" that gives the "no AoO" ability to your flyby attacks? Of course, I don't have the book on me right now, so I don't remember the prereqs...

--B--

 

[Deset Gled]

Where does Fell Flight Invocation come from? Is this one of the things that I'm missing out on by not having Complete Arcane yet?

Fly-by-Attack is a well known way to get around the problems of Shot on the Run and Spring Attack, but the fly speed is not easy to get. You could do the same thing by casting Fly. With this new spell, it still needs to be recast every day, and can be dispelled. Also, like Chorn said, you have to fly, which makes you vulnerable to wind spells and the like. Powerful, sure. Fragile, you bet.

 

[Shadeus]

Where does Fell Flight Invocation come from? Is this one of the things that I'm missing out on by not having Complete Arcane yet?

Fly-by-Attack is a well known way to get around the problems of Shot on the Run and Spring Attack, but the fly speed is not easy to get. You could do the same thing by casting Fly. With this new spell, it still needs to be recast every day, and can be dispelled. Also, like Chorn said, you have to fly, which makes you vulnerable to wind spells and the like. Powerful, sure. Fragile, you bet.

Fell Flight is from Complete Arcane. It's a fly spell with a movement of your base land speed and a duration of 24 hours. So even if dispelled, just recast it. Warlocks can cast the spell an unlimited number of times.

 

[UltimaGabe]

It also doesn't stop you from provoking for the movement, not exactly spring attack though pretty close to Shot on the Run.

Yes, which is why it's *almost* Spring Attack and Shot on the Run. However, considering it requires one feat expenditure (as opposed to three, two of which are somewhat sub-obtimal) is pretty darn good.

Where does Fell Flight Invocation come from? Is this one of the things that I'm missing out on by not having Complete Arcane yet?

Yes. The fact that I mentioned Eldritch Blast (which, as most people should know, is the Warlock's main ability) should have been a clue to the fact that I was talking about Complete Arcane. Sorry, but it's kinda irritating when someone goes to a topic thread that's obviously about something from the new book (which even happens in cases where the book's name is specifically mentioned in the title) and asks where it's from or what it is. If you don't have the book, obviously the topic thread isn't going to be of use to you. Once again, sorry, but you're not the only one to do it.

 

[Trainz]

Yes. The fact that I mentioned Eldritch Blast (which, as most people should know, is the Warlock's main ability) should have been a clue to the fact that I was talking about Complete Arcane. Sorry, but it's kinda irritating when someone goes to a topic thread that's obviously about something from the new book (which even happens in cases where the book's name is specifically mentioned in the title) and asks where it's from or what it is. If you don't have the book, obviously the topic thread isn't going to be of use to you. Once again, sorry, but you're not the only one to do it.

Keep it civil: Don't engage in personal attacks, name-calling, or blanket generalizations in your discussions. Say how you feel or what you think, but be careful about ascribing motives to the actions of others or telling others how they "should" think. People seeking to engage and discuss will find themselves asking questions, seeking clarifications, and describing their own opinion. People seeking to "win an argument" sometimes end up taking cheap shots, calling people names, and generally trying to indimidate others. My advice: don't try to win.

I'm sure you meant no disrespect Gabe, but Deset Gled might be intimidated by your reply. I'm sure that wasn't your intent though.

Back on topic...

Thanks for pointing that out Gabe. It's quite interesting. The first look (quick glance) I had at the Warlock was "Woah, this guy is way overpowered". Then after studying it for a while, I thought "Meh... he's not so good after all. No way am I playing this" but a few hours ago, I studied it once again, this time taking the time to study individual invocations and how they could be mixed and matched with assumed game parameters, and I've got to say, I changed my mind again. Not overpowered, but certainly fun to play.