SRD excluded monsters

[CRGreathouse]

That's an interesting one. Is the Phrenic template in the SRD? If so, you can just make a Phrenic manticore. If it isn't, why isn't it? It hardly seems like important IP.

It confused me, too; all the comparable template examples made it in. Then again, as I didn't include the sample vampire (and another example creature from the MM?) perhaps this shouldn't even be on the list.

Certainly, as you pointed out, one could recreate the monster from the SRD.

 

[Drifter Bob]

Why are those monsters missing from the SRD? Is it policy or some kind of accident? Is this the same SRD as the sovelior SRD?


DB

 

[TroyXavier]

Policy. Basically WOTC feels these monsters are iconic and therefore they're WOTCs toys only so to speak.

 

[Aeolius]

And isn't there an aquatic umber hulk subspecies, the Vodyanoi?

There used to be. Now revised in Frostburn, the vodyanoi is an altogether different beastie (I prefer them as aquatic umber hulks, myself).

(edit: might I point out that, while his choice of footwear is stylish, it is hardly appropriate for hopping about on rocks.)

 

[Mouseferatu]

There used to be. Now revised in Frostburn, the vodyanoi is an altogether different beastie (I prefer them as aquatic umber hulks, myself).

But the new one is far closer to the actual vodyanoi of (Russian, I believe) myth.

I love the idea of aquatic umber hulks, don't get me wrong. I'm just glad they're not called vodyanoi anymore.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

RISE, THREAD! RISE FROM YOUR DEATHLY SLUMBER!

Monster Manual:
Beholder
Beholder, gauth
Carrion crawler
Displacer beast
Githyanki
Githzerai
Kuo-toa
Mind flayer (Illithid)
Slaad, blue
Slaad, death
Slaad, gray
Slaad, green
Slaad, red
Umber hulk
Yuan-ti abomination
Yuan-ti halfblood
Yuan-ti pureblood

Expanded Psionics Handbook:
Githyanki, psionic
Githzerai, psionic
Mind flayer, psionic
Phrenic manticore
Yuan-ti, psionic
Thri-kreen

Epic Level Handbook:
Paragon mind flayer
Slaad, black
Slaad, white

The list of SRD-excluded monsters has always struck me as odd: Are these really the most iconic D&D monsters? Where's the rust monster? The gelatinous cube? The demi-lich? The drow (a weird Gygaxism distinct from their mythological origins)? Mimics? Green slime? Regenerating, mossy, skinny trolls? Ropers? Bullettes? OWLBEARS?

Why are frog-men from Limbo on there? Or intelligent bugs that seem ripped from Edgar Rice Burroughs or the displacer beast, which is straight-up ripped off from A. E. van Vogt?

I had thought about creating new counterparts of this list for my Castles & Crusades campaign, but looking at them, I don't really see much need for most of them. The beholder, the carrion crawler, the displacer beast, the mindflayer, sure, maybe even the umber hulk. But seven flavors of slaadi? Generic snake-men?

This list almost reads like favorites of the guy who thought some stuff needed to be excluded, rather than a serious attempt to identify D&D core product identity.

 

[wingsandsword]

I had thought about creating new counterparts of this list for my Castles & Crusades campaign, but looking at them, I don't really see much need for most of them. The beholder, the carrion crawler, the displacer beast, the mindflayer, sure, maybe even the umber hulk. But seven flavors of slaadi? Generic snake-men?

This list almost reads like favorites of the guy who thought some stuff needed to be excluded, rather than a serious attempt to identify D&D core product identity.

I agree. It's a pretty damn arbitrary list. Of that list, I always thought Beholders, Mind Flayers and Displacer Beasts were the only serious losses, the things that were just really common, iconic D&D creatures that were lost out on.

I also found it really, really funny that while Illithid are Product Identity and not in the SRD, the Illithid-related monster the Neothelid is in the SRD in both the Psionic section and the Modern Arcana section.

 

[Treebore]

Its kind of complicated. MOST monster are drawn directly from myth and legend, so cannot be copyrighted. So the monsters WOTC kept out of the SRD are the ones that are actually original creations that they owned outright. Others are/were still owned by the original creators, most of which, if I remember correctly, first appeared in issues of White Dwarf magazine. As far as I know, none of those creators have ever tired to maintain control of their creations, and may have even stated they put them out there for everyone to use. Someone would have to find out the terms under which they appeared in White Dwarf to have any definite idea.

So yeah, somewhat complicated.

Slaadi aren't in the SRD? Then Monkeygod got lucky with Black Ice Well.

 

[Alzrius]

I'm guessing that Black Ice Well was, like Paradigm Concepts' Unveiled Masters: the Essential Guide to Mind Flayers, begun before the finished SRD was released, and third-partty companies were all using the Gentleman's Agreement instead (for instance, St. Cuthbert is mentioned in Necromancer Games' The Wizard's Amulet).

Strictly speaking, some Product Identity terms could be technically used...but only because they slipped into the SRD by accident (e.g. "eladrin"). I suspect this is how Necromancer/Frog God Games is able to have monsters like the Slaad Lord of Entropy and the Slaad Lord of the Insane in their Tome of Horrors books (though I may be wrong).

 

[Voadam]

Its kind of complicated. MOST monster are drawn directly from myth and legend, so cannot be copyrighted. So the monsters WOTC kept out of the SRD are the ones that are actually original creations that they owned outright. Others are/were still owned by the original creators, most of which, if I remember correctly, first appeared in issues of White Dwarf magazine. As far as I know, none of those creators have ever tired to maintain control of their creations, and may have even stated they put them out there for everyone to use. Someone would have to find out the terms under which they appeared in White Dwarf to have any definite idea.

So yeah, somewhat complicated.

Slaadi aren't in the SRD? Then Monkeygod got lucky with Black Ice Well.

Its more complicated. Slaad and Githyanki/zerai are from the 1e Fiend Folio which got them from White Dwarf and were written by Charles Stross. The Githyanki he developed were based on the Githyanki from George RR Martin's first book the dying of the light. This was all at the time of first publication rights in magazines and not work for hire so it does not appear WotC exclusively owns these creations outright.