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Star Trek Picard SPOILERS thread
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<blockquote data-quote="GreyLord" data-source="post: 7953705" data-attributes="member: 4348"><p>In that case, there was a creator of the second Disney Star Wars movies who was the most toxic thing ever to hit Star Wars. The things he called minorities and Woman as a white male...I have to say I've never seen anyone THAT toxic.</p><p></p><p>I've actually defended Kennedy on multiple occasions in her position, or at least the position she represents in Hollywood.</p><p></p><p>People talk about toxic cultures in relation to Star Wars, but a LOT of that was driven by this one particular Last Jedi maker's treatment towards women and minorities online. He is a White Male. What he called some women who were minorities doesn't even make sense (why would he a white male even be calling them racist misogynists? It doesn't even make sense in relation to what they were saying and even less sense in relation to who they were!?).</p><p></p><p>Is that what you mean as toxic...as he personally has insulted several women I am friends with? (I don't even understand why Disney hasn't openly disassociated itself with him...any other company that had that type of representation would have and has in the past...even WotC had it's problems with a creator and eventually disassociated with him, though it wasn't at first).</p><p></p><p>This is representative of where the problems I see lie in the mainstream Star Wars today. Rather than listening to criticism, some of those that are representing the line have openly made blatant insults (and some of them I cannot even repeat here as there is one particular that was quite...crud in it's insult to women...just that normally would have been enough to disassociate from a creator with most companies) to people, sometimes when those insults make absolutely no sense when you actually know who the people being insulted are.</p><p></p><p>I think his reactions and doing what he did is what caused the entire blow up of the issues related to Star Wars. If he had not done what he did, I think there would have been a LOT LESS of an issue, less confrontations, and less insanity of it all. (Personal opinion). I know those he insulted in an unreasonable way now find fault, no matter how small, with Star Wars.</p><p></p><p>Kelly Marie Tran is an unfortunate incident (and so was Ahmed Best and Jake Lloyd...who ironically had JJ fall into the hate crowd on them to a degree...but I find many who label others as toxic like to sweep that one under the rug???) and I would say that is not something that should have happened. </p><p></p><p>The way Boyega was treated more recently by supposed Star Wars fans was also very sad...not so sure why you wouldn't point that out as it is more recent than Tran. Boyega handled it pretty smoothly and respectfully. Kudos to him. </p><p></p><p>I wasn't even aware it had happened until after the entire event occurred...but I could see that also as what people would label as toxic.</p><p></p><p>Unfortunately, I see the term toxic tossed around a LOT these days. It is tossed around so much these days as a way to DISMISS rather than listen that I generally find it as being a way to insult people rather than to take the time to actually listen to the criticism.</p><p></p><p>I think this started with the above creator I pointed out of The Last Jedi labeling EVERYONE (including woman and minorities) as toxic no matter how valid the criticism may have been or may be in almost any reply. When a White male is trying to insult women and minorities in the ways he did...it's far more toxic in my opinion.</p><p></p><p>And that is why I have problems with the way we refer to fans who may be critical of something as being called toxic or toxic fanbases.</p><p></p><p>I just bought 6 copies of Rise of Skywalker today to show my support of the SW Franchise. I find that cash will help quiet any 'toxicity' about a brand if there is enough of it. Rather than toss away complaints by calling them toxic...support the brand in a way that counteracts things instead.</p><p></p><p>Anyways, this is a Star Trek thread so I'm off topic. In that light, I haven't actually seen the toxic fanbase people have talked about thus far. Maybe it's the forums I am in, or the forums I participate in, but I haven't seen any real persecution of individuals over Star Trek. I still have much of the thread to finish though so maybe I'll read about it coming up?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="GreyLord, post: 7953705, member: 4348"] In that case, there was a creator of the second Disney Star Wars movies who was the most toxic thing ever to hit Star Wars. The things he called minorities and Woman as a white male...I have to say I've never seen anyone THAT toxic. I've actually defended Kennedy on multiple occasions in her position, or at least the position she represents in Hollywood. People talk about toxic cultures in relation to Star Wars, but a LOT of that was driven by this one particular Last Jedi maker's treatment towards women and minorities online. He is a White Male. What he called some women who were minorities doesn't even make sense (why would he a white male even be calling them racist misogynists? It doesn't even make sense in relation to what they were saying and even less sense in relation to who they were!?). Is that what you mean as toxic...as he personally has insulted several women I am friends with? (I don't even understand why Disney hasn't openly disassociated itself with him...any other company that had that type of representation would have and has in the past...even WotC had it's problems with a creator and eventually disassociated with him, though it wasn't at first). This is representative of where the problems I see lie in the mainstream Star Wars today. Rather than listening to criticism, some of those that are representing the line have openly made blatant insults (and some of them I cannot even repeat here as there is one particular that was quite...crud in it's insult to women...just that normally would have been enough to disassociate from a creator with most companies) to people, sometimes when those insults make absolutely no sense when you actually know who the people being insulted are. I think his reactions and doing what he did is what caused the entire blow up of the issues related to Star Wars. If he had not done what he did, I think there would have been a LOT LESS of an issue, less confrontations, and less insanity of it all. (Personal opinion). I know those he insulted in an unreasonable way now find fault, no matter how small, with Star Wars. Kelly Marie Tran is an unfortunate incident (and so was Ahmed Best and Jake Lloyd...who ironically had JJ fall into the hate crowd on them to a degree...but I find many who label others as toxic like to sweep that one under the rug???) and I would say that is not something that should have happened. The way Boyega was treated more recently by supposed Star Wars fans was also very sad...not so sure why you wouldn't point that out as it is more recent than Tran. Boyega handled it pretty smoothly and respectfully. Kudos to him. I wasn't even aware it had happened until after the entire event occurred...but I could see that also as what people would label as toxic. Unfortunately, I see the term toxic tossed around a LOT these days. It is tossed around so much these days as a way to DISMISS rather than listen that I generally find it as being a way to insult people rather than to take the time to actually listen to the criticism. I think this started with the above creator I pointed out of The Last Jedi labeling EVERYONE (including woman and minorities) as toxic no matter how valid the criticism may have been or may be in almost any reply. When a White male is trying to insult women and minorities in the ways he did...it's far more toxic in my opinion. And that is why I have problems with the way we refer to fans who may be critical of something as being called toxic or toxic fanbases. I just bought 6 copies of Rise of Skywalker today to show my support of the SW Franchise. I find that cash will help quiet any 'toxicity' about a brand if there is enough of it. Rather than toss away complaints by calling them toxic...support the brand in a way that counteracts things instead. Anyways, this is a Star Trek thread so I'm off topic. In that light, I haven't actually seen the toxic fanbase people have talked about thus far. Maybe it's the forums I am in, or the forums I participate in, but I haven't seen any real persecution of individuals over Star Trek. I still have much of the thread to finish though so maybe I'll read about it coming up? [/QUOTE]
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