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<blockquote data-quote="Xorn" data-source="post: 4291662" data-attributes="member: 61231">Stated by others before, but I'll repeat it--isn't the reason Sneak Attack adds more damage than the Warlock or Ranger damage increases because it's harder to get Combat Advantage?&nbsp; Can anyone say (with a straight face) that it's harder to get combat advantage on pretty much any target you like with the current Stealth as intended?Because if the closest monster to the ranger is a minion--guess what, a minion is going to eat an extra +d6.&nbsp; (When possible, I will toss a minion closer than a standard+ creature to remove Quarry/Curse damage from the equation.)As far as encounters--a dwarf fighter with a maul can deal out some pretty horrific punishment with a tiefling warlord next to him.But back to Stealth, I just can't understand how the developers felt that the way they intended for Stealth to work is this way.&nbsp; Ozzie (being the resident rogue in my group) has stated point blank that he's glad I'm going with Stealth only avoids notice--and he's the one with that really stands to gain from it!Apparently anyone trained in Stealth can ignore cover--if they just find some cover!&nbsp; (Combat Advantage offsetting enemy Cover).&nbsp; But that's the bottom line for us... with Stealth as intended it's easier to gain Combat Advantage at range than it is in melee!Percival Padfoot, the halfling rogue, currently has +12 Stealth.&nbsp; That means that if he tries to hide in cover (say... behind the damned dwarf) his MINIMUM stealth is a 13.&nbsp; The passive perception of a kobold slinger is 11.&nbsp; That's right, it just can't see him.&nbsp; He instantly gets Combat Advantage, he doesn't even have to roll.&nbsp; Just put an ally between you and what you want to kill, and stealthily exploit the rules as intended.&quot;Where did the halfling that just killed Roger go!?&quot;&quot;I don't know, Gary!&nbsp; He ducked behind that dwarf, and now he could be anywhere!&quot;I'd like to restate, one last time:&nbsp; Stealth as intended is the only thing I hate about 4th Edition.&nbsp; But I really hate the <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> out of it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Xorn, post: 4291662, member: 61231"] Stated by others before, but I'll repeat it--isn't the reason Sneak Attack adds more damage than the Warlock or Ranger damage increases because it's harder to get Combat Advantage? Can anyone say (with a straight face) that it's harder to get combat advantage on pretty much any target you like with the current Stealth as intended? Because if the closest monster to the ranger is a minion--guess what, a minion is going to eat an extra +d6. (When possible, I will toss a minion closer than a standard+ creature to remove Quarry/Curse damage from the equation.) As far as encounters--a dwarf fighter with a maul can deal out some pretty horrific punishment with a tiefling warlord next to him. But back to Stealth, I just can't understand how the developers felt that the way they intended for Stealth to work is this way. Ozzie (being the resident rogue in my group) has stated point blank that he's [i]glad[/i] I'm going with Stealth only [i]avoids[/i] notice--and he's the one with that really stands to gain from it! Apparently anyone trained in Stealth can ignore cover--if they just find some cover! (Combat Advantage offsetting enemy Cover). But that's the bottom line for us... with Stealth as intended it's easier to gain Combat Advantage at range than it is in melee! Percival Padfoot, the halfling rogue, currently has +12 Stealth. That means that if he tries to hide in cover (say... behind the damned dwarf) his MINIMUM stealth is a 13. The passive perception of a kobold slinger is 11. That's right, it just can't see him. He instantly gets Combat Advantage, he doesn't even have to roll. Just put an ally between you and what you want to kill, and stealthily exploit the rules as intended. "Where did the halfling that just killed Roger go!?" "I don't know, Gary! He ducked behind that dwarf, and now he could be anywhere!" I'd like to restate, one last time: Stealth as intended is the only thing I hate about 4th Edition. But I really hate the :):):):) out of it. [/QUOTE]

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