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<blockquote data-quote="clearstream" data-source="post: 4356950" data-attributes="member: 71699">You asked for a logical analysis of your argument. You assert&nbsp;A is a pre-condition for B&nbsp;You might then be asserting&nbsp;If A, then B&nbsp;Which is not proven by the logic. I will however assume you assert&nbsp;If A, then possible B!&nbsp;Fair enough. We know that in fact&nbsp;If A and D, then B&nbsp;I'm endeavouring to pin down that D in a consistent, easy to adjudicate way, that is well supported by the body of published material. But let's say we abhor letting our DM make judgements under PHB178. In that case&nbsp;1. How is U10 Shadow Stride useful?2. Once enemies are alert, wouldn't it be easier to grant Rogues perpetual CA than roll all those minor action active Perceptions?3. Why are there 13 other ways to achieve CA, if Stealth alone will do?4. Why do Rogues have powers that help them get CA, if Stealth alone will do?5. Isn't it kind of fun for Rogues to have their cunning challenged? Rather than 'Sneak attack!' 'Use Stealth' 'Sneak attack!' 'Use Stealth'...6. Stealth is cost free. Why doesn't everyone use Stealth all the time, even untrained?7. Does Stealth only give CA; or does it do other things too? Like defensive advantages superior to those Cover or Concealment usually give?&nbsp;-vk</blockquote>

[QUOTE="clearstream, post: 4356950, member: 71699"] You asked for a logical analysis of your argument. You assert [B]A is a pre-condition for B[/B] You might then be asserting [B]If A, then B[/B] Which is not proven by the logic. I will however assume you assert [B]If A, then possible B![/B] Fair enough. We know that in fact [B]If A and D, then B[/B] I'm endeavouring to pin down that D in a consistent, easy to adjudicate way, that is well supported by the body of published material. But let's say we abhor letting our DM make judgements under PHB178. In that case 1. How is U10 Shadow Stride useful? 2. Once enemies are alert, wouldn't it be easier to grant Rogues perpetual CA than roll all those minor action active Perceptions? 3. Why are there 13 other ways to achieve CA, if Stealth alone will do? 4. Why do Rogues have powers that help them get CA, if Stealth alone will do? 5. Isn't it kind of fun for Rogues to have their cunning challenged? Rather than 'Sneak attack!' 'Use Stealth' 'Sneak attack!' 'Use Stealth'... 6. Stealth is cost free. Why doesn't [I]everyone[/I] use Stealth all the time, even untrained? 7. Does Stealth [I]only[/I] give CA; or does it do other things too? Like defensive advantages superior to those Cover or Concealment usually give? -vk [/QUOTE]

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