Still not right. IMO

[boredgremlin]

So a new edition..... okay i guess. I didnt really enjoy 4th so thats fine with me.

But... and heres my butt with the whole thing.

Why bother? It seems like more nibbling around the edges without really getting at the meat of the problems people have had the last few years. How many ways can you really adjust rolling a D20 and deciding what happens before your just making changes for the sake of change?

To me the real issue is this. People want complexity in combat, they want some simulationism. But they also want freedom of story and choice. And the real kicker that makes all this hard is no one wants to actually deal with that complexity.

Is it cool to have? Sure. Do you want to do long chains of math like the end of 3e every turn? Or have to keep track of 5 tiny little bonuses that are situational and have different durations like in 4e? Hell no. Slows everything down and kills the drama.

Its time to realize its not 1980 anymore and make some radical, fundamental changes to take into account the overall changes in entertainment.

So with that said.

What I would love to see for a 5th edition is something radically different. Digital maptools and networking aps for mobile devices and computers for instance. And lots and lots of fluff.

If they must take inspiration from a video game, and i think they must to adapt to the new enviroment, it should be like a crossbreed of the elder scrolls series and neverwinter knights .

I.E. a fairly simple intuitive rule and skill set. % system. And lots and lots of work creating a detailed fluff world and adventures rather then constantly churning out more un-necessary rules supplements.

Magic should be more free form as well. Something like the mage game but with just slightly more framework.


In my fantasy D@D 5th edition game we could all for instance be looking at our own little map screen on something digital but all be on the same map in the game on a DM's screen. And lots of the basic combat actions could be resolved automatically.

That way players could split up easier for tactics, the game would move faster (moving miniatures around and setting up the game board was always a huge hassle IMO), a computer could handle all the annoying math, and a DM could send private messages to players and put individual things that they see or hear on their own devices only without the passing back and forth of notes that constantly slow things down.

Make sure theres a DM over-ride on actions so that individuals can maintain creativity and allow the dm to adjudicate those things on the fly as well.

Then put everyone in the same room while you play and IMO you have the perfect game. Digital board and computer math. Fast setup and play, individual freedom, and RL table banter.

Plus I would be able to put a plate of pizza and soda down without worrying about messing up papers or a board.

Supplements could be a whole new city or adventure area thats totally mapped out and pre-stocked with NPC's, adventures and stories rather then another rule book of crunchy stuff that no one really needs.

And of course comprehensive but simple DM tools to adjust anything in those modules that the DM wants to adjust, giving him the freedom to control as much or as little as he wants.

Oh and map packs. Tons and tons of digital map packs that can be edited.

I dont know how many people agree with me. But its just felt to me for a while that D@D is refusing to adapt to technology changes and use them to enhance the game instead of being competition for it.

Oh and what the hell happened to WoTC's virtual table top? We're what 6 years overdue?

 

[kitsune9]

I think we'll see the digital aspects for 5e come about. After all, 4e got DDI, so I think WotC will take 5e and go into the next evolution of game technology. If WotC doesn't do it, expect third party providers to provide some really interesting digital technologies. Already, at CES this year, there was a game developer who was making a large "iPad" that was exclusively touch base that could serve as a game board, map, and so on. Their target price is $400 for it. Can't remember the company's name though.

However, as far as radical changes for a new ruleset, the only radical so far that's come out is how WotC intends to tie the play styles of the previous editions into this edition. So far, the discussion has been to break down D&D into its shared language across the editions and then add on optional features so that the new version will play like other editions. But, this is still early, so we may get to see something completely radical and new come out.

Happy Gaming!

 

[boredgremlin]

I hadnt heard about that at CES. That sounds like exactly what I've been wanting for years now.

I dont see the play style thing being radical though. Playstyle is about the players and dm not the mechanics except in a very basic way and limited circumstances.

If anything when they try to make any rule more complicated then 3e skills thats supposed to control play style they fall all over themselves and mess it up.

That aspect is probably what I am least excited to hear.

 

[Dragonblade]

Should there be more digital tools? Sure, why not.

But the bottom line is I want a game thats just as easy to both play and DM with digital tools as it is with only books, pencils, paper, and dice in front of you.

If WotC can't deliver that, than nothing else about 5e matters.

 

[kitsune9]

Here's the device that came out in CES. It's called ePawn. The version you see is their small prototype. They are supposed to come out with a version that's a little bit larger (23" I think). I think when a company gets up to 55-72", I'm ready to buy.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8L5rLZuexQ]CES 2012 - ePawn Arena - Digital board game tabletop - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Consonant Dude]

I can see why more and more digital tools to handle complexity can be seen as desirable to some but here's the thing:

For some of us, it doesn't matter if they gave us 500 free gold-plated miniature and a digital board and if a super-computer calculates all the movement and distance combat options. WE LIKE WHEN ALL THIS STUFF TAKES PLACE IN OUR MIND.

Boards and miniatures and sifting through a list of predefined list of feats and combat moves is boring to some of us. It would help if apps could speed up the process but really, at this point I just want a simple base game.

I like the unpredictable, powerful nature of the mind and I want my players to come up with different combat moves and actions based on my scene descriptions and then we have to adjust on the spot with a swift ruling and get on with the game.

I prefer a powerful core engine instead of lists of stuff we can or can't do. Cause the combinations are endless anyway, so a list of actions always comes short for my group.

 

[Sunseeker]

Here's the device that came out in CES. It's called ePawn. The version you see is their small prototype. They are supposed to come out with a version that's a little bit larger (23" I think). I think when a company gets up to 55-72", I'm ready to buy.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8L5rLZuexQ

But realistically, what's the cost? a 55-72" TV will run you anywhere between $700 and $2000 dollars. Tablet PCs(that are worth their salt) will run you upwards of $4000 easily. An iPad starts at $499. Imagine an iPad 55" across, that's gonna be several thousand dollars.

 

[Ed_Laprade]

<grump, grump, grump> I don't have any of them thar newfangled digital dohickys, and I ain't a-gonna! <grump, grump, grump>

 

[kitsune9]

But realistically, what's the cost? a 55-72" TV will run you anywhere between $700 and $2000 dollars. Tablet PCs(that are worth their salt) will run you upwards of $4000 easily. An iPad starts at $499. Imagine an iPad 55" across, that's gonna be several thousand dollars.

ePawn hasn't set a price yet, but the target is/was $400. I wouldn't recommend flipping your TV on it's side.

I think by the time we get 55-72" "iPads" (or whatever surface device that gets marketed) will be a lot cheaper than $4,000 simply because of the law of scaling. Already, you can make a DIY surface table for $1,500.

Here's their website:

ePawn

 

[kitsune9]

<grump, grump, grump> I don't have any of them thar newfangled digital dohickys, and I ain't a-gonna! <grump, grump, grump>

Why, back in my day, we had to use dice, pencils and graph paper! And we were thankful dagnabit!