Strength Clerics Getting Away With Warpriest Domains


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WalterKovacs

First Post
Hopefully in the future they implement a way to give free feats into the character builder. The feats to allow intermingling of different builds do sort of make sense in that they may not want to make the trade off too easy, etc ... a warpriest gives up more than just healer's lore and ritual casting, they also lock themselves into their at-will/encounter power selection just by picking the domain.

Strength clerics definitely get the short end of the stick, hopefully that is addressed when the class compendium gets to the cleric, or in some of the promised articles to address undersupported classes.
 

Zaphling

First Post
WotC should not shut down Strength clerics since there are a LOT of races that based off of Strength. Can you imagine a cleric of Kord using wisdom?
 

Nemesis Destiny

Adventurer
If a player came to me and asked, "hey, can I do this?" I would probably allow it. I've always been keen on class feature swapping, and especially in this case, where the feature being swapped out isn't likely to be of much use to the character. Someone wanting to play a Strength cleric is already fighting an uphill battle, so I'm okay with making things easier for them, a little.

In general though, I much prefer the approach that the Warpriest takes, making Wisdom primary. Strength-as-primary never made much sense to me for a cleric build/subclass. Some of the more warlike gods, a case can be made, but Wisdom is the stat that defines a priest's connection to the divine. A high-Strength follower of a war-like god would just as easily be a devout fighter, or maybe Fighter MC Cleric, or perhaps a Paladin. Just rubs me the wrong way, I guess.
 

Zaphling

First Post
If a player came to me and asked, "hey, can I do this?" I would probably allow it. I've always been keen on class feature swapping, and especially in this case, where the feature being swapped out isn't likely to be of much use to the character. Someone wanting to play a Strength cleric is already fighting an uphill battle, so I'm okay with making things easier for them, a little.

In general though, I much prefer the approach that the Warpriest takes, making Wisdom primary. Strength-as-primary never made much sense to me for a cleric build/subclass. Some of the more warlike gods, a case can be made, but Wisdom is the stat that defines a priest's connection to the divine. A high-Strength follower of a war-like god would just as easily be a devout fighter, or maybe Fighter MC Cleric, or perhaps a Paladin. Just rubs me the wrong way, I guess.

Although you have a point, you can also try to see the strength clerics as powered by the gods. In other words, their strength coming from the gods.

You can also try seeing it as, in Kord's case, maintaining a well-built physique in order to please the god of strength. Or in bahamut's, using the god's strength to protect the weak.
 

Nemesis Destiny

Adventurer
Although you have a point, you can also try to see the strength clerics as powered by the gods. In other words, their strength coming from the gods.

You can also try seeing it as, in Kord's case, maintaining a well-built physique in order to please the god of strength. Or in bahamut's, using the god's strength to protect the weak.
Sure, I can see your point of view, and like I said, a case can be made. I just personally don't like it. Lots of players do, and that's fine - great, even - the more options there are, the more players will be pleased.

I could, and would prefer to interpret a strong physique by having high Constitution, as in the case of the Warpriest, or even having a decent tertiary stat in Strength. A 13 or 14 is plenty - gives decent Athletics modifier when trained, opens up heavier armour types (plate by early paragon tier), although MBAs will suck a bit unless you take Melee Training (or the at-will "Sonnlinor's Hammer").
 
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The cleric was never meant to dump wisdom. Never. This is why we have not got more than 1,5 paragon paths with strength primary.

I guess the intention was balanced strength and wisdom, one a little higher than the other. So strength actually made sense at the beginning of 4e. It does not today. The warpriest is what the melee cleric has always meant to be. Maybe Wisdom primary, Strength secondary would be another good option for the melee cleric. Kicker stat and primary work differently than they were intended.
 

Solvarn

First Post
Balance wise

In the campaign I currently play in my wife started as a strength cleric. We just retconned her to a warpriest after they came out and she likes it a lot better. It accomplishes the same purpose and fills the same niche but seems to do the job better. I was never a big fan of how the different paladin and cleric builds were designed in the PHB 4E, it seemed like a lot of feats went to waste.

I think that at this point it's a little silly to play a strength cleric. Just play a warpriest and change the relevant ability modifiers for strength cleric powers.

They need to give the power swap feats a little something extra, like +2 to something, to make it more worthwhile. If you are giving something up to get something then it is a lateral conversion powerwise and you are simply giving up feat power in order to customize your character, which is stupid.
 
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