Subskills System - Anybody Got One?

[The Spectrum Rider]

I've been trying to figure out a way to handle "subskills." IMC there are characters that may have, for example, 3 ranks in Handle Animal, but are particularly good using the skill with horses. Or hve 10 ranks in Knowledge (the planes), but are sheer geniuses at Knowledge (the Plane of Fire).

It's easy enough to hand out circumstance bonuses on a case-by-case basis. But does anyone know of a system where a player can customize her character to have improved ability in certain subskills - at some cost, of course?I can imagine spending Skill Points at some pro-rated basis, charging XPs, using feats, and a host of other mechanisms.

Anybody know of any existing subskill systems out there? Or have any ideas for one?

I know that many people think there are *already* too many skills, and would like to combine them together, whereas I seem to want to go in another direction. Well, I don't want to use subskills for everything (Use Rope [silk], Use Rope [hemp], Use Rope [telephone wire] . . . .) But some character concepts just call out for them; and sometimes players ask for them.

Thanks for any help.

The Spectrum Rider

 

[Thanee]

Hmm... maybe use the shadowrun specialisation rules.

You can specialise in one particular "sub-skill" (DM's approval, it would be a bit too much to list those for every skill), giving you a +1 (broad group) or +2 (tight group) on any checks with that, but a -1 to all other checks with the skill.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Quickleaf]

Hmm...I love Shadowrun, but that way of handling it always bothered me. I mean, a character who has ride (horses) +2, but ride (anything else) -1 would be worse than a character with no skill in riding at all. That doesn't seem right! Edit: Oh, but in Shadowrun you only get to specialize in a skill once you spend a certain number of points, huh? I guess I stand corrected.

The system I am considering using is this...
Any skill point a PC applies to a skill can be either spent as normal or put into a sub-skill. Each skill point buys 2 ranks in a sub-skill for a class skill or 1 rank in a sub-skill for a cross-class skill. Maximum rank limits in sub-skills are 2 higher than the standard skill. For example at 1st level, the maximum ranks a PC can invest in a class skill are 4, and a cross-class skill are 2. However, for sub-skills, the maximum ranks are 6 for a class sub-skill, and 4 for a cross-class sub-skill.

As far as sub-skills are concerned, in addition to skill specific specialties, most skills have 2 other components that aren't usually recognized: Contacts and Knowledge (treated slightly differently than in the SRD). Both of these specializations *require* skill points to be used. In addition, they are purchased on 1:1 ratio of points to ranks (instead of 1:2) and can only be gained for class skills. Contacts, which determines people you know in the field, is modified by Cha and Knowledge, which determines what you know about the field, is modified by Int. When a character is in a situation in which multiple specializations apply, the character may add the ranks of the two skills together, exceeding their maximum rank in the skill. NOTE: This rule does not usually apply to Contact and Knowledge skills.

Thus a 1st-level PC decides to spend 6 skill points in the Ride skill. The player envisions a princess haunted by a broken family who took to competing in local peasant jumping contests disguised. The campaign is a fantasy campaign, and since griffons and other magic mounts exist, the DM has decided that Ride (horse) is a viable specialization.
The player decides she has a Ride (horse) skill of +6 (this costs 3 points). She also decides to have a Ride (jumping) skill of +2 (costs 1 point). She decides that she knows many of the palace stablehands by name, and gives her character Ride (contacts) +1 (costs 1 point). Finally, she was educated by the best equestrians in the kingdom and knows how to take good care of a horse, and gives her character Ride (knowledge) +1 (costs 1 point).

Thus, our 1st-level heroine looks like...
Ride (horse) (Dex) +6 -- as per the SRD
Ride (jumping) (Dex) +2 -- can I get my mount to clear that ravine? can I get my mount to jump over the line of soldiers?
Ride (contacts) (Cha) +1 -- will a stablehand take extra good care of my horse? can I find someone who will buy these stolen horses from me? can I request an audience with a fellow competitor in the jumping contest? do I know any good furriers in town who can make me a new pair of horseshoes?
Ride (knowledge) (Int) +1 -- is this horse really a pure bred? has it been injured in the past? what are the rules for a jumping contest? from what breed does that famous knight's horse hail? how does one properly groom a horse? how is a saddle and bridle put on?

 

[DanMcS]

There is precedent for using feats for something like this. A feat can grant a +2 bonus to two skills (alertness), a +3 bonus to one skill (skill focus), or a +4 bonus to one skill in limited circumstances (combat casting). Allowing a "subskill focus" feat that granted a +4 to one skill in limited circumstances, with a prereq of 1 rank in that skill or something, would probably work.

 

[CRGreathouse]

I have a small number of skills in my campaign with similar specialization. I've used the following mechanic, reminiscent of the 3.0 Perform rules: a subskill is chosen immediately with the skill, and another (at equal skill) at 6, 11, 16, etc. ranks.

 

[Rasyr]

Perhaps you should take a look at HARP (full PDF on sale for $2 until January 3rd). It contains sub-skills, and specialized skills, and works quite well I think.

 

[aco175]

What about having a system where a character takes 1 rank in Ride and can use 3 or 4 sub-ranks to spend in any of the Ride sub-skills. You can have a standard ratio, or divide it among each skill, with some giving more for those with more sub-skills.