Sultans of Smack

[Sir Hawkeye]

In response to hypersmurf:
In theory, yes.

Of course, one requires 3 feats to create, and the other only requires one.

 

[Sir Hawkeye]

You are reading it wrong; by your logic, you could prepare an empowered, maximized vampiric touch as a 3rd-level spell, for example.

No, because the descriptions of the feats state that the spell takes up a slot higher than its actual level. That prevents it from being prepared in a 3rd-level spell slot (or cast with a 3rd-level spell slot for sorcerers.)

 

[Darkness]

No, because the descriptions of the feats state that the spell takes up a slot higher than its actual level. That prevents it from being prepared in a 3rd-level spell slot (or cast with a 3rd-level spell slot for sorcerers.)

And the same goes for a spell storing weapon. See the point now?

 

[Sir Hawkeye]

As a DM, it bothers me somewhat, and I might house rule that magic item cost is based on spell slot level used. However, in any case, I would consider maximized empowered magic missile to be able to be placed in a wand, despite using a 6th level spell slot.

As a potential Sultan of Smack, it bothers me not a whit, as it has no bearing on the matter at hand.

 

[Sir Hawkeye]

And the same goes for a spell storing weapon. See the point now?

Spell Storing: "Spell... of upto 3rd level"

Minor Globe of Invulnerability: "Spell effects of up to 3rd level"

Globe of Invulnerability: "4th-level spells and spell-like effects"

I submit that the terms Spell and Spell Effects are used interchangeably (as demonstrated by Minor Globe and Globe) for the purposes of the Globe spells. This makes the terminology of Spell Storing and Minor Globe identical. The description of Heighten Spell specifically states that most metamagic feats do not affect the ability of a spell to penetrate a Minor Globe of Invulnerability. Therefore, I submit that most metamagic feats (excepting only Heighten Spell) do not affect the ability of a spell to be placed in a Spell storing weapon.

!

 

[Darkness]

As a DM, it bothers me somewhat, and I might house rule that magic item cost is based on spell slot level used. However, in any case, I would consider maximized empowered magic missile to be able to be placed in a wand, despite using a 6th level spell slot.

Got you now!

PHB, p. 78:
Magic Items and Metamagic Spells: With the right item creation feat, you can store a metamagic spell in a scroll, potion, or wand. Level limits for potions and wands apply to the spell's higher, metamagic level.

Also, please note that there's no mention of Heighten Spell in this quote - but since what Heighten Spell does to a spell is the exception rather than the rule, this would need to be pointed out in case it was being referred to in this general rule. But it isn't!

 

[Darkness]

Spell Storing: "Spell... of upto 3rd level"

Minor Globe of Invulnerability: "Spell effects of up to 3rd level"

Globe of Invulnerability: "4th-level spells and spell-like effects"

I submit that the terms Spell and Spell Effects are used interchangeably (as demonstrated by Minor Globe and Globe) for the purposes of the Globe spells. This makes the terminology of Spell Storing and Minor Globe identical. ...

No, it doesn't; why should it? Again: By this kind of logic, a wizard could prepare, say, a quickened fireball in a 3rd-level slot. Which he can't. Thus, what you are proposing is no universal rule, sorry.

Case in point: Do you think you can use a 3rd-level pearl of power to regain a maximized lightning bolt that you've just cast?

 

[Darkness]

No, he accepts that. But he's saying that you're preparing a 3rd level spell in a 7th level slot.

I know that he accepts this specific situation (i.e., preparing spells with metamagic feats); it's just that he doesn't see that it's the same for everything else, too. But it is the same nonentheless...

 

[Darkness]

Except for purposes of counterspells, save DC, and penetrating Globes?

I meant preparing spells, putting spells into items, figuring the price for magical items, and similar situations. Sorry for being too vague.

 

[Darkness]

Chain lightning cannot be stored in wands.

He's right; you'd have to use staffs for that...