SW Saga: The Munchkin Jedi Thread

[Nifft]

So. Let's cheese the whiz out of the Force.

- - -

Use The Force Early And Often: You get your Force powers back whenever you roll a natural 20 on a Use The Force check. Thus, the more non-power things you can Use The Force to accomplish, the sooner you'll refresh your stock of shtick.

Force Powers:

- Force Grip does automatic damage each round to one target, may disable a target (limit him to one Swift action), but the best part is that it lasts multiple rounds so long as you concentrate, and you make a fresh Use The Force check each round. The longer you grip, the more chances you have to win.


Force Talents:

- Force Perception (Sense tree) - you can use Sense Influence as a full-round action (for free), and the other uses are likely to come up often in some combats - if you have this talent, and you are in a fight with a lot of concealment, you may feel more free to expend your Force Powers, since you will be getting them back soon.

- Force Pilot (Sense tree) - not a ton of synergy, given how few Force Powers work on star ships. Might be good if you can affect pilots, or if you can Force Move an enemy's terrestrial vehicle, but won't scale well in space.

- Force Persuasion (Jedi Consular tree, requires Adept Negotiator) - TONS of synergy! It's like getting a free Force Stun, though a tiny bit weaker; also, you get to roll Persuasion checks using Use The Force, so you may get multiple uses out of your Mind Trick power during a single negotiation.

- Force Intuition (Jedi Guardian tree) - Do you see a lot of foes using Feint against you? If so, this may be nice. Otherwise, don't bother -- you don't need to refresh your maneuvers Force Powers at the beginning of an encounter.

- Block / Deflect (Lightsaber Combat tree) - DING DING DING!!! Paydirt! Useful, free, possibly multiple uses each round, requires no action on your part. Depending on the campaign, one may be more useful than the other; it's probably worth considering both though.

- Lightsaber Throw (Lightsaber Combat tree) - Eats your Standard and Swift actions for only a single Use The Force check, but may be nice when you run out of Force Grip uses. I'm kinda meh on this one. Only take it if you can reliably hit 20 on your Use The Force check -- otherwise you're just disarming yourself.

- - -

Those are my thoughts up to now. More cheesy tricks please!

Cheers, -- N

 

[Stalker0]

Its there a talent that lets you manifest telekinetic abilities as a move action? You can toss that one out and then another use the force check ability. The more you roll, the more you win!!

Also, if you want to cheeze it a bit more bit up a level of scout with fringer savant. I mean if we are going for 20's on our UTF checks, might as well get some nice free force points to go with it!!

 

[Victim]

The Move Object power can be maintained from round to round as well, and throwing the same object to make UtF versus Ref seems allowed.

 

[Nifft]

Ah, missed a couple in Use The Force itself:

Search Your Feelings -- uses a Standard action; hopefully your DM won't get sick of this trick. Think of some good questions to ask (yourself) if you're ever pinned down in battle with nothing else to do.

Sense Surroundings -- uses a Swift action; gives your next Perception check a bonus. Very good synergy with Force Perception, of course.

Cheers, -- N

 

[pawsplay]

Knack is a good talent.

How about choosing a race that gets rerolls with a skill, then taking a Talent that allows you to use UtF for that skill? Rerolls mean more 20s.

 

[Nifft]

Its there a talent that lets you manifest telekinetic abilities as a move action? You can toss that one out and then another use the force check ability.

Ah, that is nice. But it's not free -- you're still using up two Force Power slots. Your chance of recovery per slot use hasn't actually increased.

Also, if you want to cheeze it a bit more bit up a level of scout with fringer savant. I mean if we are going for 20's on our UTF checks, might as well get some nice free force points to go with it!!

That explains so much about Luke...

The Move Object power can be maintained from round to round as well, and throwing the same object to make UtF versus Ref seems allowed.

Good find! Thanks!

Knack is a good talent.

What tree is that from?

Also, good note about races. I see that Perception can be re-rolled by Zabrak, Sullustan and Rodians; Pilot may be re-rolled by Duros; and Initiative may be re-rolled by Cereans.

However, looking through the races for these re-rolls revealed a hidden gem: Kel Dor can re-roll Use The Force checks to search their feelings or sense the force. Neither use is great unless you're pinned down and out of Force Powers, but at least you'll get three free Use The Force rolls each round (one Swift action to Sense Surroundings, then two more to Sense Force user around you as a full-round action).

Cheers, -- N

 

[comrade raoul]

One other nice thing about Sense Surroundings is that you can take a Force Technique to use it as a free action. I'd rule that you could still only use it once per round as such, but that's still an extra shot at recovering your force powers.

I think this is the only Force Technique apart from Force Point Recovery (awesome, BTW) worth taking.

 

[Donovan Morningfire]

So. Let's cheese the whiz out of the Force.

- - -

Those are my thoughts up to now. More cheesy tricks please!

Just keep the old saying in mind about rules manipulation...

If your PC can manipulate a rules loophole to their advantage, can the GM's NPCs

I've always gotten a kick out of turning rule manipulation back on the player in question, especially if their being an obnoxious twit about it.

Of course, looking over some of the things you listed, they'd only kick in if the GM allows multiple rolls for the same things over and over.

As for Block/Deflect, they do suffer from diminishing returns, both from the hefty penalty for each use and the fact your Reflex Defense increases a lot faster than your skill check bonus, although Deflect still provides a benefit as enabling usage of Redirect Shot, where Block doesn't have that.

 

[Victim]

One other nice thing about Sense Surroundings is that you can take a Force Technique to use it as a free action. I'd rule that you could still only use it once per round as such, but that's still an extra shot at recovering your force powers.

I think this is the only Force Technique apart from Force Point Recovery (awesome, BTW) worth taking.

The take 10 one might not be so bad either, for certain powers. With Move Object, for instance, the character will have certain success with far larger objects. Having say a 40% of failure lifting a huge object can make it a bit of gamble in combat, especially if you need to grab something huge to get bigger damage (I'm not sure if damage goes by check result or object size). Do or do not.

For my feats and talents, I'd rather go overkill on Force Training than simply pray for 20s. Refreshing more often is nice, but not having control over when is a major downside. Rolling well when you're only out 1 power out of many isn't that great of a deal. And I'm not sure that burning a swift action UtF is a great use of resources, compared to spending it on part of a recovery, using a second wind, etc - the swift action, while still allowing most powers or attacks, is a significant limiter.

 

[comrade raoul]

The take 10 one might not be so bad either, for certain powers.

Truth. I could also see it being helpful for the buff powers (Surge, Battle Strike) at high levels, when you can get the best result by taking 10 but still run the risk of doing worse if you roll. But:

For my feats and talents, I'd rather go overkill on Force Training than simply pray for 20s.

I'm in favor of taking Force Training once or twice, doubling up on the powers you expect to use a lot, and then relying on Force Points to recover powers you really need. This is something that a Jedi Knight with Force Point Recovery can totally do: if you get three free Force Points per encounter, your use of Force Points is limited more by the one-point-per-round rule than your actual total. (You'll be able to spend a Force Point every round, at least when you're faced with a significant threat.)

And I'm not sure that burning a swift action UtF is a great use of resources, compared to spending it on part of a recovery, using a second wind, etc - the swift action, while still allowing most powers or attacks, is a significant limiter.

Also true, I think. Jedi in particular really need their swift actions.