SWSE galaxy at war question

[Aaziroth]

Ok, having a debate with one of my players with some of the info in this book...

He says this book isn't cannon, as some of the info listed only appears in this book and this book alone... specifically under "indirect fire weapons" it lists; heavy cannon, light cannon, field gun, howitzer, & mortar... he says they aren't canonical as star wars doesn't use artillery, that this book is only about star wats galaxy at war video game, and none of the artillery was ever used... so which is it? Is artillery cannon or not, and if so which pieces of artillery was around during the end of the mandalorian wars? We're at around 3962 bby.

 

[S'mon]

You're the GM, you determine cannon canon for your game!

Of course it would be pretty bloody stupid for there to be no indirect-fire weapons (other than thrown thermal detonators?) in the Star Wars universe; the first nation to invent them would have a huge advantage.

 

[jonesy]

...specifically under "indirect fire weapons" it lists; heavy cannon, light cannon, field gun, howitzer, & mortar...

Those are all just generic names for types of artillery deployment. So, of course they are available. It's what they really are what you should, and can, decide.

Besides, what does he mean Star Wars doesn't use artillery? Hasn't he seen any of the movies?

I mean, how do you miss this:
V-150 anti-orbital ion cannon - Wookieepedia, the Star Wars Wiki (yeah, ok, not indirect)

Take a look at these for more examples:
Artillery - Wookieepedia, the Star Wars Wiki Especially the Defoliator.
Saga-Edition.com: The Star Wars Saga Edition RPG Databank Republic Artillery Gun

And as the DM you can just make ones up. Star Wars is a huge place and there must be thousands of artillery pieces in existance that haven't appeared in the stories. It would be unreasonable to assume that the ones that have been detailed are the only ones that exist.

 

[Aaziroth]

Thanks, that's what I thought, but every example was clone ears or later, not a single example of artillery late in the mandalorian wars... anyone know of any examples of artillery dating that far back?

 

[Aaziroth]

To be more specific, wanting to know if the republic had any indirect fire weapons such as something akin to howitzers during the final years of the mandalorian wars

 

[jonesy]

I can't think of any examples from back there. All I can say is that indirect artillery exists in Star Wars.

And trying to figure out what is or isn't canon isn't simple. Even the official response is greatly mixed on that.

But even going by G-Canon, there's indirect artillery in the Prequel movies.

Going by T-Canon, you'll find them in Clone Wars.

Many of the games are partially C-Canon, partially S-Canon, and partially N-Canon.

It's silly, really.

I'd just tell your player not to sweat it too much. Thinking about Star Wars canon is bound to make blood vessels in your brain pop.

 

[Steel_Wind]

To be more specific, wanting to know if the republic had any indirect fire weapons such as something akin to howitzers during the final years of the mandalorian wars

You are making a common error here in terms of describing technological advancement in the Star Wars Universe. The Star Wars Universe is one where technology has essentially been stretched to the limits of possible achievement in all areas.

Star Wars assumes that technology has reached a climax across the board. All technological changes at this point are largely cosmetic or fractions of a percentage incremental improvements in terms of relative cost and performance. While every thousand years or so there is some true breakthrough which goes beyond tiny incremental changes (a whole 3 PERCENT better, instead of .01 percent !), these innovations are exceedingly rare.

In the millenia before KotOR, we saw the old lightsabers with an external power pack. By the time of KotOR, the self-contained power pack (a significant development across all technology) was in effect. But 4,000 years later -- it's the same tech. There has been no improvement of note. Power technology and integration is at a MAX level.

The end of scientific and engineering advancement is a very difficult concept to square with -- but it is at the heart of the Star Wars Universe, just the same.

So the tech in the days of The Old Republic might be not quite as cheap and not quite as good as in the days of the Rebellion Era. But we are STILL talking comparatively small variations and very minor improvements upon a theme. In terms of the broad brush, the tech has existed for 12,000+ years at a mature "climax" level of implementation.

Societies in both epochs have learned, in terms of science and engineering, all there is to know as a practical limit of knowledge. (Economies and societies ability to exploit this knowledge at a practical level changes greatly from locale to locale). But on Corruscant? It's pretty much always been at that level for thousands of years. Changes there are pretty much just about putting old wines into new bottles.

So yes, the artillery which is quite clearly depicted in the Clone Wars animated series was around 4,000 years earlier in the Old Republic era too -- and at all times in between. And before that, too, frankly.

 

[Aaziroth]

Even though th3 write up on most of the clone wars artillery states that it was first introduced during the clone wars?

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

Even though th3 write up on most of the clone wars artillery states that it was first introduced during the clone wars?

One can easily handwave that away if one likes, since the Clone Wars were quite likely the largest series of military actions the galaxy had seen in millennia, so indirect fire artillery was probably not seen very often until the Clone Wars broke out, at which point the old designs got dusted off, any process improvements available applied, and sent on out the door.

I seem to recall indirect artillery in Galactic Battlegrounds. It wasn't really that efficient, SFAICT, as they weren't terribly accurate and the damage wasn't really that impressive. They were most likely in the game as a legacy from Age of Empires. It was more efficient, overall, to build assault mechs (like AT-ATs), or, with the expansion, star cruisers, and have them blow stuff up.

The only real time indirect artillery would be of use in Star Wars, I imagine, would be when neither side had air superiority. Otherwise, manned and unmanned aerial attack vehicles would be more efficient overall, since they could be repurposed to do, pretty much, whatever, and would likely be more accurate. But if your fighters and missiles can't get to the target, and you either can't or don't want to engage in orbital bombardment, then indirect artillery is going to be useful. You might, in peacetime, build your heavy assault vehicles so they can conduct artillery operations if needed, since that gives the unit more overall utility, but in wartime, specialist artillery vehicles might be better off.

Brad

 

[Insight]

Also, remember that each of these books goes through an approval process through LucasFilm. This is why so few books got produced (among other reasons). Someone at Lucasfilm approved whatever is in the Galaxy at War book. If anyone complains, throw that at them.