Systems Where You Dread Running Combat

[Doug McCrae]

I definitely dread running combat in the HERO System, in fact I quit GM-ing a game because of it. After running one, zero combat, session quite successfully, there were upcoming battles against very large numbers of foes in the next one. I decided there was no way I could run the game I'd prepared under the HERO rules, as combat would take too long and be too mentally taxing for me.

 

[Doug McCrae]

Therefore I concluded Champions is an excellent game if you want to set up a very tactical, grid based superhero combat in a predefined battle space. I would thoroughly enjoy a three hour set piece battle of Champions with my friends where every chin-bleeding punch and teetering building and knock back is played out. But it doesn't fit how I would want to play a super hero roleplaying game.

I've played and run a lot of Champions and I agree with this completely. It contains one of the best combat mini-games in roleplaying but what I want from a superhero rpg is primarily emulation of superhero comics.

 

[pogre]

I'm with the OP on WFRP 4e - way too fiddly. For the campaign I finished recently we fell back to the 2e rules.

Millennium's End was a game I loved, but dreaded the combat.

Generally, if I don't like the combat system I won't run the game.

 

[Thomas Shey]

Low performance or low ability does not equal malevolence. I'm not saying if someone has poor DM skills they are "bad" people. Though most people take criticism in that way.

However, your response to me seemed to think I was talking about malevolence (otherwise the "bad faith" comment makes no sense), so I was making it clear my objection in no way assumes that.

 

[aramis erak]

I've played and run a lot of Champions and I agree with this completely. It contains one of the best combat mini-games in roleplaying but what I want from a superhero rpg is primarily emulation of superhero comics.

Which is why 99% of my Hero System play has been Fantasy Hero 2E (which is the HSR4 version),,, tho I did a 1 shot of FH1E... the differences were enough to annoy.... and a few 1-shots of champions, and played Danger International and Justice, Inc.

It's great for pulps or fantasy... justt not for Supers. It is, however, the singularly most flexible medium-heavy universal ruleset I've used. (I've not yet used Genesys... but even from a read only, its less flexible)

 

[Thomas Shey]

Which is why 99% of my Hero System play has been Fantasy Hero 2E (which is the HSR4 version),,, tho I did a 1 shot of FH1E... the differences were enough to annoy.... and a few 1-shots of champions, and played Danger International and Justice, Inc.

It's great for pulps or fantasy... justt not for Supers. It is, however, the singularly most flexible medium-heavy universal ruleset I've used. (I've not yet used Genesys... but even from a read only, its less flexible)

Even this depends on how much you do or don't expect supers to change across media. I can't say my Champions games ever felt like anything but superhero games to me, but I don't expect a game to look exactly like a movie to look exactly like a comic book.

 

[aramis erak]

Even this depends on how much you do or don't expect supers to change across media. I can't say my Champions games ever felt like anything but superhero games to me, but I don't expect a game to look exactly like a movie to look exactly like a comic book.

It didn't even feel close to the supers comics, TV shows, nor movies. Given this was in the 1990's... the movies weren't that good.
Advanced Marvel Super Heroes did, however.
Marvel Heroic Role-Play did even better.
Sentinel Comics does it best, for me... but not for everyone.

If I were to start a new group with players I don't know, I'd go MHRP/Cortex Prime.
If I were starting a group for traditional gamers who don't care for new-fangled dice tricks, I'd got AMSH.
If I were starting a group for storygamers, Sentinel. Comics.

If I were starting a group for medieval super-heroes, I'd grab D&D 5E or Pugmire...

 

[Thomas Shey]

It didn't even feel close to the supers comics, TV shows, nor movies. Given this was in the 1990's... the movies weren't that good.

And it absolutely did to me. Don't know what to tell you.

 

[aramis erak]

And it absolutely did to me. Don't know what to tell you.

You have a much higher tolerance for procedurally complex combat in your supers games than I, or apparentlly, Doug McCrae.
I don't think there's much more to be said.

 

[Thomas Shey]

You have a much higher tolerance for procedurally complex combat in your supers games than I, or apparentlly, Doug McCrae.
I don't think there's much more to be said.

You could probably extend that in general, so that's fair. I don't find procedurally complex combat impairs my interactions with roleplaying and story, well, anywhere. In fact, it often helps keep me engaged and therefor more in sync with other elements of the game.

 

[aramis erak]

You could probably extend that in general, so that's fair. I don't find procedurally complex combat impairs my interactions with roleplaying and story, well, anywhere. In fact, it often helps keep me engaged and therefor more in sync with other elements of the game.

I tolerate it in settings where it's uncommon or low numbers.
My player base has a lower tolerance than I do.

 

[Thomas Shey]

I tolerate it in settings where it's uncommon or low numbers.
My player base has a lower tolerance than I do.

And there's the difference; I (and the majority of my players) actively seek it out.

 

[Emirikol]

Im pretty much to the point of this: if I need a computer or vtt to resolve combat "more smoothly," its not for me.