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Taking 20 Too Often
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<blockquote data-quote="Li Shenron" data-source="post: 3359647" data-attributes="member: 1465"><p>For those who hate Take20, don't get carried away by the RAW...</p><p></p><p>Take20 exists because some checks would make very sense to be possibly tried over and over and over.</p><p></p><p>Think of Search: without the Take20 rule, a Rogue player could make a roll and get a 5, the DM tells him he finds nothing. Then player knows he rolled too low, and can be tempted to try again, eventually until he gets a 20, and knows he cannot do better. This is of course if the DM considers it appropriate to roll in the open (some DMs do, by the assumptions that a character should be able to guess how good it was at something).</p><p></p><p>Another DM may choose to roll the Search hidden. Still, the Rogue player could always just say "I search 5 times" to increase his chances. Not seeing the result, he can never be truly sure he rolled a 20 at some point, but still he could choose <strong>as a tactic</strong> to e.g. always Search 10 times to have a 40% chance of rolling a 20, or 20 times to have a 65% chance, etc...</p><p></p><p>The PHB just wants to avoid that kind of thing, which is increadibly boring for everybody else at the gaming table, and just say "forget about it, if you are just going to keep rolling, cut it short and Take20".</p><p></p><p>The "penalty for failure" thing is only an addition to help gamers remember that sometimes you just can't try the same thing over and over. If you are jumping over a pit of lava, you can't go back unharmed every time. But of course if you don't die at the first failure, you CAN swim out and try again <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite7" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue :p" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":p" /> </p><p></p><p>Then of course there are cases where it simply doesn't make sense, such as when retries don't depend on you: a repeated noise (e.g. someone talking in another room, the sound of a distant waterfall) can be heard by Take20. An instant noise cannot (e.g. a single gunshot, a specific name being mentioned by someone in the other room).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Li Shenron, post: 3359647, member: 1465"] For those who hate Take20, don't get carried away by the RAW... Take20 exists because some checks would make very sense to be possibly tried over and over and over. Think of Search: without the Take20 rule, a Rogue player could make a roll and get a 5, the DM tells him he finds nothing. Then player knows he rolled too low, and can be tempted to try again, eventually until he gets a 20, and knows he cannot do better. This is of course if the DM considers it appropriate to roll in the open (some DMs do, by the assumptions that a character should be able to guess how good it was at something). Another DM may choose to roll the Search hidden. Still, the Rogue player could always just say "I search 5 times" to increase his chances. Not seeing the result, he can never be truly sure he rolled a 20 at some point, but still he could choose [B]as a tactic[/B] to e.g. always Search 10 times to have a 40% chance of rolling a 20, or 20 times to have a 65% chance, etc... The PHB just wants to avoid that kind of thing, which is increadibly boring for everybody else at the gaming table, and just say "forget about it, if you are just going to keep rolling, cut it short and Take20". The "penalty for failure" thing is only an addition to help gamers remember that sometimes you just can't try the same thing over and over. If you are jumping over a pit of lava, you can't go back unharmed every time. But of course if you don't die at the first failure, you CAN swim out and try again :p Then of course there are cases where it simply doesn't make sense, such as when retries don't depend on you: a repeated noise (e.g. someone talking in another room, the sound of a distant waterfall) can be heard by Take20. An instant noise cannot (e.g. a single gunshot, a specific name being mentioned by someone in the other room). [/QUOTE]
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