Thanks, guys, you've ruined Haste for the rest of us.

[Lucius Foxhound]

You're right SimonMoon5... it's houserulers who've ruined a perfectly good spell for all of us. A sister organziation to S.H.I.N.Y is S.H.I.N.Y - Save Haste in the New Year. They've been doing some tremendous work to save this valuable spell.

Keep up the good work!

 

[Pielorinho]

Re: Re: Re: Thanks, guys, you've ruined Haste for the rest of us.

Could you make it Will instead (so it scales with the Inflict spells)?

NO! MWAHAHAHAHAHA!

Daniel

 

[Shalewind]

Oh boy... Here we go. For those of you that want to see the fires at their height I suggest you go lounge over by the DR thread.

Perhaps Quicken Spell has been altered a little? Perhaps. NO ONE KNOWS for sure...

And Lucius, you're just upset because you'll have to rally SHINY against all this new rumor about the Harm fix.

As for balance... EVERY magic user had haste. When making custom spells the general rule is, if every wizard would have this, it is too powerful... Hence, Haste has been changed. It was a part of every smackdown...

And 3E is not balanced for arena combat. So what if the wizard can't out do damage with the fighter. That sure as hell isn't why I play a wizard. I know my place in the party (which is where the balance is, in the party). And I also know that that unsuspecting fighter wouldn't stand a chance as long as I have a good month or two to plan. ::EVIL LAUGH::

Anyways. I'd hold judgement until you've seen all the changes and have a little faith in the developers. They have playtested you know.

 

[hammymchamham]

Ah, I see. So the change to Haste is fine, because maybe the DM won't use it?

Stop being a jerk, ok? I never said it was fine. If so, please directly quote me. You asked me what if the DM uses the change that 3.5 will make. There is nothing I can do to stop them, heck, I can't stop someone from doing the change now. I can't stop my DM from making the change now, and I can't stop any of your DMs. All I said was talk to them DM. Like you, I think Haste is fine as it currently is (there is a direct quote for you). All I said was to TALK to the DM. Or do you just give up when the DM says "I'm going to use the rules 100%." Do you not ask about different house rules you've heard of that you may use that have improved your game? I've done so. The DM has incorporated some things, and others he cut. No loss of sleep on my end. So stop mis quoting people.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

Ah, I see. So the change to Haste is fine, because maybe the DM won't use it?

Well, the change will certainly make damage-dealing spells even more pointless than they already are.

I don't like the new haste they turned a too good for 3rd level spell into a too weak for 3rd level spell. But this point is scary. If damage dealing spells become more useless(and yes now past mid levels they are fairly useles) you knwo what that means, more save or die spells a flying. Yippie I just can't wait for all my encounters to be decided on the roll of one die. I know I'm just gona love mass hold monster.

 

[Enkhidu]

Re: Re: Thanks, guys, you've ruined Haste for the rest of us.

MWAHAHAHAHA! Bow before my leet WOTC-mind-control skillz!

Daniel
off to kick puppies, steal candy from babies, and give a Fort save to Harm

No way! Just move Heal and Harm ot 8th level and plug in Cure Wounds spells at 6th and 7th level (for 6d8+lvl (max 30) and 7d8+lvl (max 35) respectively). It makes more sense!

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

I don't like the new haste they turned a too good for 3rd level spell into a too weak for 3rd level spell. But this point is scary. If damage dealing spells become more useless(and yes now past mid levels they are fairly useles) you knwo what that means, more save or die spells a flying. Yippie I just can't wait for all my encounters to be decided on the roll of one die. I know I'm just gona love mass hold monster.

Not just save or die, but all those exciting rolls for targetted dispels. It is virtually impossible for a wiz to grind down a tough monster without the extra spell per round in 3e, so his only options will be doom spells or buffing others. That is not a problem balancewise, but it is not necessarily the style I want to play.

My personal opinion is that the 3e Haste makes a fine 4th level spell, quite comparable to the devastating effect of a properly used Improved Invisibility or Confusion. Not sure if that fixes things for high level play, but it seems right for up to ~13th level.

 

[Shalewind]

That is not a problem balancewise, but it is not necessarily the style I want to play.

I can see your point. It is entirely possible that a new version of Haste is in the spell list somewhere. As could a provision for casting multiple spells in a round. The Quicken Aspect might also have been revised.

I don't think think the Haste "issue" will cause an eversweeping change toward "save or die" rather than fireball and damage spells.

I do have an issue with the dispel wars though. Of course, I don't like that you can't have really nifty spell duels in 3e either. I'm waiting to see their new spell list which supposedly has new spells and new applications.

 

[Grog]

I'm just curious about the mid level fighters doing 150 points of damage per round. For an 11-12th level fighter, that's 50 points per attack! And that means every attack is hitting, every single round. I don't see how a fighter of that level can dish out that kind of damage consistently over the course of an entire adventure. Maybe a smackdown type character could, but smackdown characters are usually built to use up a lot of resources for one fight.

And, as a mid-level wizard, if you think damage spells aren't cutting it, you have plenty of other options. Disintegrate, Polymorph Other, Hold Monster, Charm Monster, Confusion, etc.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

And, as a mid-level wizard, if you think damage spells aren't cutting it, you have plenty of other options. Disintegrate, Polymorph Other, Hold Monster, Charm Monster, Confusion, etc.

Yes you can, but is that the game you want to play. As Ridley's Cohort pointed out it may not be a balance issue, but its not necesarrily the style of game you might want to play. I know it's not the style of game I want to play.