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<blockquote data-quote="Gothmog" data-source="post: 4398830" data-attributes="member: 317">Yeah, 4e does pretty much solve the 15 minute adventuring day IME.&nbsp; We've played 4e from 1st to 6th level now, and had NO 15 minute days.&nbsp; In 3e, it didn't happen often in my group, but it did happen, on average about once every 2 adventures.&nbsp; Core 3e assumes WAY more combat than I usually use, so I scaled back the number of encounters, but made them tougher.&nbsp; Yes, I realize that might make the 15 min day more common, but it wasn't the planned encounters that made the PCs go rest after one fight- it was random encounters or set-piece encounters to lead into the plot and story that made them do the 15 minute day thing.&nbsp; Nothing breaks pacing and continuity of a game like when PCs finish an encounter, only to retreat and rest up to full resources, only to return again 12 or so hours later.&nbsp; I started having monsters and NPCs make preparations while the PCs were resting- fortifying defenses, relocating, tracking the PCs back to their resting spot and attacking, etc- basically responses that any intelligent enemy would take if they discovered someone had attacked or messed with their minions/brothers in arms.3e did absolutely nothing to discourage this either.&nbsp; Usually it wasn't hit points that were running low, or PCs weren't down and dying, but it was that the wizard or cleric had blown some of their big gun spells in the encounter, and wanted to come back and use those big guns again.&nbsp; This problem gets MUCH worse in 3e once 5th level and above spells become available (scry and teleport, I'm looking at you).&nbsp; 4e is better designed in this regard, because healing surges are available to every character (thus reducing mandated healers in the group), and most powers recharges after an encounter.&nbsp; Daily powers are meant to be used when the situation is dire, or against elites or solos- and its usually pretty easy to tell who those critters are.&nbsp; I've had numerous &quot;days&quot; pass in 4e I and many of my players NEVER used the daily power, since it didn't seem like I/they needed it, and no suitable target presented itself.&nbsp; But when you do use your daily....WOW....some nasty things can happen.&nbsp; I've not seen the 15 minute day happen in 4e.&nbsp; I have seen characters get so beat up after 2 or 3 encounters they are out of healing surges and retreat to rest and regroup, but thats been over the course of 3-5 hours in game time.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Gothmog, post: 4398830, member: 317"] Yeah, 4e does pretty much solve the 15 minute adventuring day IME. We've played 4e from 1st to 6th level now, and had NO 15 minute days. In 3e, it didn't happen often in my group, but it did happen, on average about once every 2 adventures. Core 3e assumes WAY more combat than I usually use, so I scaled back the number of encounters, but made them tougher. Yes, I realize that might make the 15 min day more common, but it wasn't the planned encounters that made the PCs go rest after one fight- it was random encounters or set-piece encounters to lead into the plot and story that made them do the 15 minute day thing. Nothing breaks pacing and continuity of a game like when PCs finish an encounter, only to retreat and rest up to full resources, only to return again 12 or so hours later. I started having monsters and NPCs make preparations while the PCs were resting- fortifying defenses, relocating, tracking the PCs back to their resting spot and attacking, etc- basically responses that any intelligent enemy would take if they discovered someone had attacked or messed with their minions/brothers in arms. 3e did absolutely nothing to discourage this either. Usually it wasn't hit points that were running low, or PCs weren't down and dying, but it was that the wizard or cleric had blown some of their big gun spells in the encounter, and wanted to come back and use those big guns again. This problem gets MUCH worse in 3e once 5th level and above spells become available (scry and teleport, I'm looking at you). 4e is better designed in this regard, because healing surges are available to every character (thus reducing mandated healers in the group), and most powers recharges after an encounter. Daily powers are meant to be used when the situation is dire, or against elites or solos- and its usually pretty easy to tell who those critters are. I've had numerous "days" pass in 4e I and many of my players NEVER used the daily power, since it didn't seem like I/they needed it, and no suitable target presented itself. But when you do use your daily....WOW....some nasty things can happen. I've not seen the 15 minute day happen in 4e. I have seen characters get so beat up after 2 or 3 encounters they are out of healing surges and retreat to rest and regroup, but thats been over the course of 3-5 hours in game time. [/QUOTE]

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