D&D 4E The 4E Magic System

[GreatLemur]

Wouldn't it take up less space to say "if you cast fireball as a lvl 5 spell, it does 5d6. If you cast it as a lvl 20 spell, it does 20d6"? Then it's what level you cast it at that defines the parameters of the spell, and you only need to write the spell up once, plus the scaling details....kinda like the Expanded Psionics Handbook.

That's exactly what I'm saying, yeah. Those "25th level spells" we've heard about might not actually appear on spell lists. It might only mean that now a 25th-level Wizard can choose to cast magic missile as a 25th level spell.

 

[HeinorNY]

My predictions:
-Spells scale up by character level not class level. The same with most class powers. This makes multiclassing more viable.
-There won't be a real magic system anymore, as a distinct sub-system. Spells will work pretty much like class powers, or at least, all arcane powers will have the same sub-system, the same with other sources.
-

 

[Scribble]

T-Spells scale up by character level not class level. The same with most class powers. This makes multiclassing more viable.

I think it will be half your level.

 

[Baby Samurai]

The designers have stated that you will cast spells/powers at the level in which you gained that spell/power.

So I guess if you gain a spell at 7th level you cast it as a 7th level spell, so this 25th level spell business we've heard about is obviously cast at the level that spell was gained - 25th.

 

[BartD]

The designers have stated that you will cast spells/powers at the level in which you gained that spell/power.

So I guess if you gain a spell at 7th level you cast it as a 7th level spell, so this 25th level spell business we've heard about is obviously cast at the level that spell was gained - 25th.

I remember reading the same, but I can't say I like the sound of it.

It will be so much neater and make much more sense if spells and powers simply scale with level (or half level or whatever), that way you won't have to ponder whether to get the power now or wait until it's stronger. That will be a really weird choice.

 

[Majoru Oakheart]

The designers have stated that you will cast spells/powers at the level in which you gained that spell/power.

What was said was that "powers are named after the level you get them at"
So, a 25th level spell is the one you get at 25th level.

I don't know if they'll scale or not, but I have a feeling they will scale minorly as has been said before. 1st level power doing 1d6+character level in damage, so that by the time you get to 20th level and have a power which is doing 20d6+character level, there's no reason not to swap lower level spells for higher level ones.

Plus, if they restrict the number of spells you can have "known" to a very small number, it forces you to specialize, reducing your overall power. Which is the design goal for wizards.

 

[Baby Samurai]

What was said was that "powers are named after the level you get them at"
So, a 25th level spell is the one you get at 25th level.

That's basically what I said – stop nitpicking.

 

[Cadfan]

That's basically what I said – stop nitpicking.

He's not nitpicking. He's pointing out that just because a spell is a 15th level spell, we can't conclude that its "cast as a 15th level spell." All we know is that level 15 is the level at which the spell is gained.

For all we know, "cast as an X level spell" may be a meaningless statement in 4e. It exists in 3e because of spell slots stratified by level, but that may be gone in 4e.

 

[Baby Samurai]

He's not nitpicking. He's pointing out that just because a spell is a 15th level spell, we can't conclude that its "cast as a 15th level spell." All we know is that level 15 is the level at which the spell is gained.

Yes, he/she is.

I basically repeated what the designers stated, that spells are of a level at the level you gained/learned it.

Can we stop this now, or are we that bored?

 

[Puggins]

The "spells not scaling" bit worries me a bit. I DO NOT want to see fireball I to IX, each doing different amount of damage. That's one innovation of online games and other RPGs that I'd like to leave out of D&D, thank you very much. That said, there's plenty of ways to not scale a fireball and still not use that absurd little convention.

I'm thinking that the new wizard slots are going to be drastically different than what we're talking about here. I'm assuming that what they mean by "siloing" is that they're going to use the pact magic model from Tome of Magic.

Sure, the spells are going to be levels 1-30, but the wizard won't have spell slots for each level. Instead, he'll have a number of "silo slots," just like a binder, the ToM pact mage. in his case, the correct term for the silos is vestiges. The binder starts with one vestige employable, and scale to only four by 20th level. Each vestige grants you three to five abilities, their power scaling with the level of the vestige.

The wizard, I'm betting, will have very few prepared slots, making creating an NPC wizard much easier. Each slot will grant you at will, per encounter and per day spells to cast. Slots will scale, hopefully, so that you'll have lesser flame, flame, and greater flame spell themes, but you won't have Flame I to XXX.

The item affinities will then be pretty easy- the staff grants all elemental affinities +1CL, or something along those lines. More powerful staves will grant you more uses of the per day spell, add more CL, or whatever.

Anyway, that's my guess.