The Incredible Mystery of the Missing Monsters...

[KnowTheToe]

But you still don't have the Steel Dragon!!!!

You want it all man!

What would you do if they had the Steel Dragon? That's right, you don't know what you would do. You have to leave some stuff for the future. Think about the future. The future. future.

 

[Crothian]

But you still don't have the Steel Dragon!!!!

Steal Dragons? Why would you want to steal a dragon anyway?

 

[Kilmore]

There's still a fiend folio coming out, right?

 

[Mangrum]

The wolfwere can also be found in Denizens of Darkness.

 

[Grazzt]

There's still a fiend folio coming out, right?

April or so of 2003. It appears to be more of a sourcebook than a pure monster book though (at least from what I know about it).

 

[Winterthorn]

Tome of Horrors, eh? I was under the impression most of the content of ToH would be unique and variant outsiders accompanied by a host of original critters. I wasn't aware it would reintroduce 1E critters for 3E to the degree advertised.

So I have more questions:

1) Are there only 1E monsters converted? What about those first appearing in 2E or OD&D that haven't shown up yet?

2) Did Necromancer get special rights to some old TSR material? (I assume the affirmative.) I am curious about the details--at least those that may be told

3) And like Kilmore asked, seeing so much coming out in "re-release" what could possibly left for WotC's Fiend Folio?

Does anyone else have monsters MIA they are looking for?

-W.

 

[Grazzt]

Tome of Horrors, eh? I was under the impression most of the content of ToH would be unique and variant outsiders accompanied by a host of original critters. I wasn't aware it would reintroduce 1E critters for 3E to the degree advertised.

Nope- there are about 300 conversions, 120 original monsters plus 30 or so others from Necromancer Games modules and stuff.

There is a list of all the monsters in the ToH forum at the Necromancer Games forums:

http://pub123.ezboard.com/fnecromancergamesfrm31

Note: There were a few late additions that are not included in the List. Mostly stuff I did and kept sending to Clark ("We gotta put this in.", "Ok." "We gotta put this in too.")

So I have more questions:

1) Are there only 1E monsters converted? What about those first appearing in 2E or OD&D that haven't shown up yet?

Yeppers- some 2e stuff. Not a lot though. As for OD&D..yes. There are some monsters, for example, from B3 Palace of the Silver Princess (the original "banned" version) that havent seen print in over 20 years. Some monsters from some other old OD&D modules and books as well.

2) Did Necromancer get special rights to some old TSR material? (I assume the affirmative.) I am curious about the details--at least those that may be told

Well- suffice to say that we (Clark and I) worked very closely with WotC regarding the Tome, MM2, BoVD, and FF. They knew what we were doing and we knew what they were doing.

There is minimal overlap between our book and the 3e MM2, BoVD, and 3e FF. (By minimal I mean a handful of monsters we did will appear in one of those three books). The rest are ours! (And we got all the cool ones....)

3) And like Kilmore asked, seeing so much coming out in "re-release" what could possibly left for WotC's Fiend Folio?

Conversion-wise...not a lot. New monster-wise. There is always room for new monsters.

 

[Winterthorn]

Thanks Grazzt!

What an amazing list of monsters ya have there for ToH! (I took a trip to Nercromancer's board via your link.)

Thanks for the answers too, but... I got another 2 questions :

What is the format/layout in the ToH like compared to other products? Have you set up a monster/monster "group" per page, say? (The MM has been criticized for some lack of clarity in its organization affecting its use.)

And what about colour and art? Is there an image for each critter? (If keeping most of it b/w lowers cost, I won't mind too much if the content otherwise remains excellent.)

Yeah, it looks like I will have to procure this baby.

BWT: Am I correct in guessing the ToH "counters" the end of WotC's 6 month agreement with ENWorld concerning monster conversions? (I ask this in pragmatic terms rather than any assumption on my part of a direct relationship between the two events. I not entirely up-to-date regarding all the publishing issues out there.)

-W.

 

[rounser]

It appears to be more of a sourcebook than a pure monster book though (at least from what I know about it).

To hazard a guess, a sourcebook concerning the lower planes? Or maybe, the "Deities & Demigods" of demon lords and archdevils? Probably not, because the BoVD covers some of them. I hope it's not either of those...

A fan-submitted monster book just like the original was would have been fine...

 

[Grazzt]

Re: Thanks Grazzt!

What an amazing list of monsters ya have there for ToH! (I took a trip to Nercromancer's board via your link.)

Thanks! I still think we got the better end of the deal.

What is the format/layout in the ToH like compared to other products? Have you set up a monster/monster "group" per page, say? (The MM has been criticized for some lack of clarity in its organization affecting its use.)

Originally it was gonna be one monster to a page. Then I kept adding monsters and it got too big, so it will be similar to the old 1e MM or 3e MM (but much easier to discern which monster goes where. There is a preview (full artwork included) on Necromancer's site. There is also a preview of the cover art as well:

http://www.necromancergames.com

And what about colour and art? Is there an image for each critter? (If keeping most of it b/w lowers cost, I won't mind too much if the content otherwise remains excellent.)

Art for each and every monster. And no "grouping" of the monsters. Each has a picture that is next to or within the text detailing it. Even if there are some in there you have never heard of, you will have absolutely no probs telling which pic goes with which monster.

The art is all black-and-white. It wasn't really a cost-saving feature. Clark and I decided a long time ago to do it black-and-white. It kept with the 1e feel that way.

BWT: Am I correct in guessing the ToH "counters" the end of WotC's 6 month agreement with ENWorld concerning monster conversions? (I ask this in pragmatic terms rather than any assumption on my part of a direct relationship between the two events. I not entirely up-to-date regarding all the publishing issues out there.)
-W.

Nah- just coincidence. We've had this in the works for a while. The original projected (but never announced) release date was like August, but I kept designing new stuff and then we decided to do art for ALL (rather than most) monsters and it bumped the book back a bit.

But- it is on schedule for its announced release date of November 2002; hardback, over 400 monsters...$29.95

Also- the grace period to "get legal" dealt more with the module conversions than anything else. A lot of them were verbatim text of the original modules and in some cases included the ESD of the original module as well. Others were conversions of the original that had been altered how ever the "converter" saw fit (i.e., rather than converting it straight into 3e, sometimes liberties were taken to rewrite and alter encounters, etc.)

As for the monster conversions hosted in the Conversion Library, I have no idea about them. I just track the ones on my site. And they were all legal. All I had to do was include a copy of the OGL and then list the monster's name in Section 15 along with the original source and converted version copyright info.