The Magic Items that WotC cannot publish

[Stoat]

The Magic Item Compendium was pretty cool. The tables were helpful for adding flavor to the "big six" .

It would have been a lot cooler to have in March 2000 instead of March 2007.

 

[Alex319]

By contrast, try to throw a sword of rat-farting into a 4E treasure parcel, and the system simply won't compute ("##error - hand slot entry: useless")

How? Presumably, like every other magic weapon in the system, it will have an enhancement bonus of ceil(level/5). And presumably the power you put on it will be useful.

Let's compare the systems (it's been a while since I've looked at my 3e books so I might be getting something wrong there - correct me if I'm wrong about anything)

In 3e, you put whatever powers you want on a magic weapon. You calculate the cost as (2000 * (n+k)^2) + c, where n = enhancement bonus of item, and k = sum of "bonus equivalents" of all the powers you put on, and c = "extra cost" for those enchantments that just have extra costs, not bonus equivalents.

In 4e, you put a power on an item, and calculate the level of the item as (5n-4)+k, where n = enhancement bonus of item, and k = "extra levels" the power is worth, which goes from 0 (basic magic weapon) to 4. If you want to extend this system to combine multiple powers on an item, it's pretty simple, just add the values of k together. For example, if you want a weapon that is +2 has the powers of both a duelist's weapon and a frost weapon, you could make that, and it would be level 10 (k=2 for duelist's weapon, k=2 for flaming weapon, just add them together). Or if you want to make your own weapon power you can just decide how much "k" should be by comparing it to existing powers.

Like I said, I think that if we understood exactly what kind of item you want to make, we could explain how to make it in the existing system. I don't know what a "sword of rat-farting" is supposed to do, so I can't help you there - but if you told me what power you wanted it to have I could explain how you could make it.

 

[pawsplay]

You know, the Weapons of Legacy/Unearthed Arcana approach could be adapted to 4e, with certain items being "unlockable" and having a paragon and epic path associated with them. The base item would not have to be super powerful, but obviously would need to be durable.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

You know, the Weapons of Legacy/Unearthed Arcana approach could be adapted to 4e, with certain items being "unlockable" and having a paragon and epic path associated with them. The base item would not have to be super powerful, but obviously would need to be durable.

Yes, that's a possible route. A mix of multiclass or multiclass like feats, paragon paths or epic destinies.

The items could also work as items that combine multiple slots, either directly (maybe an armor occupying feet, arm, armor, hand, and head slots) or indirectly (suppressing other items property). They can also be set items which were introduced with Adventurer's Vault 2.

 

[nightwyrm]

Yes, that's a possible route. A mix of multiclass or multiclass like feats, paragon paths or epic destinies.

The items could also work as items that combine multiple slots, either directly (maybe an armor occupying feet, arm, armor, hand, and head slots) or indirectly (suppressing other items property). They can also be set items which were introduced with Adventurer's Vault 2.

That's pretty cool, but I would think that such items would be rather campaign specific. I keep thinking that the "special" magic items that kept being brought up in this thread would be rather like a 4e version of stuff from Weapons of Legacy. But speaking of that, were Legacy Weapons really weak? I've never seen them mentioned in any CharOps board.

 

[pawsplay]

That's pretty cool, but I would think that such items would be rather campaign specific. I keep thinking that the "special" magic items that kept being brought up in this thread would be rather like a 4e version of stuff from Weapons of Legacy. But speaking of that, were Legacy Weapons really weak? I've never seen them mentioned in any CharOps board.

Weapons of Legacy was actually a pretty subpar book. The weapons are usually underwhelming, the "costs" were okay but sometimes could really mess you up (like if you used the paired weapons that were supposed to be used together), and the way the designers used Knowledge checks is completely different than in the PHB ("no retries") but it was never spelled out how they should be used.

Conceptually, it was a nice idea, but honestly, I prefer Unearthed Arcane's version with its specialized PrCs.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I was similarly underwhelmed by the actual Weapons of Legacy in the book, but I actually thought the idea had merit.

After all, its not an uncommon trope in fantasy that a weapon is far more than it seems to be, and that a magic item's abilities may only reveal themselves over time. Sometimes, its only effective for persons of a certain race, faith, bloodline, age, skill level, or those who have completed a certain ritual.

In D&D, though, that's pretty rare. Usually, its in the form of "for most characters, this weapon is just a +1 Sword, but in the hands of (race, alignment, class), it confers the following abilities (LIST)."

 

[nightwyrm]

I've been thinking about how an item might grow along with a character. What if instead of handing out a magic item treasure parcel, you use that treasure parcel to upgrade an item, say a weapon, that a character already holds.

So, after a "plot event" a character's old weapon is upgraded to have the enhancement bonus, crit bonus, powers and properties of a weapon of a new level while retaining still its old properties and powers. It would be a bit more powerful than a brand new item, but maybe you could include a cost such as the character permanently losing a healing surge or something. If the new weapon have multiple daily powers, you'd still only be able to use one daily per extended rest as per the rule regarding items and dailies.

I don't think it would be too unbalancing. You might want to watch out for certain property combos, but since the item is constructed by the DM by using plot coupons and not directly controlled by the player, it should lessen the risk for abuse. Essentially, I'm thinking of Legend of Zelda where you get to upgrade your mastersword several times over the course of the game.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

That's pretty cool, but I would think that such items would be rather campaign specific. I keep thinking that the "special" magic items that kept being brought up in this thread would be rather like a 4e version of stuff from Weapons of Legacy. But speaking of that, were Legacy Weapons really weak? I've never seen them mentioned in any CharOps board.

The question might be what we are actually looking for?

Do we want unusual, funny, subtle stuff, like a Flaming Sword that can also start (small) fires at range by shooting small flames (with no combat application aside from the usual "creativity with stunts and DMG p 42").

Do we want The Sword of Elemental Fire that does all things fiery? Shoot Flames, grant fire resistances, surrounds you with fire, causes your enemies burn marks, commands elemental fires? (But that is still not a real artifact with its own goals. It's just good with fire)

What are we really looking for when we talk about "cool" magic items instead of boring
ones? Do we look for powerful effects? For more versatility? (Why can my Armor only be either Summed or Agile and not both?) For purely "narrative" effects (like lightening up candles and camp fires?)?

A mix of all of that?

 

[ferratus]

I stated upthread that the power level of the magical items wasn't important.

Instead, magical items have to exist on their own merits, and do things that are cinematic for magical items to do.

When the magic item simply does a single discrete power, in the confines of being a daily/encounter power, and is disposable based on your character's level, there is little wonder left in the magical item.