The Power of 5

[That One Guy]

This does not sound like a Points of Light setting to me. Points of Light should have limited economic wealth except in hidden treasure troves. 1st level Kobolds should not be carrying around expensive gems.

I agree. One of the things I've read somewhere is that they suggest that not everything have as much treasure, but that they earn that much for the whole level's worth... so there can be treasure vaults or 'captain' monsters that have a small amount of wealth compared to the others.

For example, in my pre-4e game, most of the time monsters have a handful (1D12) copper and at most 1D4-1 silver (minimum 0). But, they're now in the castle of the main evil dude and have started killing his personal guards/captains. They have more wealth, and the PCs all noticed that these guys HAVE gold pieces. I think this sort of... economic balance for the monsters is in the hands of the DM. WotC is just suggesting how much cash they estimate PCs to have by what level... but as always, these are just guidelines.

 

[Doug McCrae]

I'm a bit disappointed that 4E designers did not take into consideration DMs who do not want to be handing out 10+ millions of GPs of monetary and magic item treasure per PC over 30 levels.

It's pretty easy to houserule. I plan to run a low cash game for my first 4e campaign, I won't be keeping track of money at all. Figure the PCs can afford all mundane stuff. There won't be a market for ritual components, very few casters around, so the PCs have to acquire those themselves.

 

[Craw Hammerfist]

Greenspan wept

Nobody understands the real economy, so why would a simulated economy make sense? I will use the economy presented in the books, because I presume it has been playtested to some degree. Assuming a monetary motivation for PCs is fine, but the real purpose of the monetary system is to balance the challenge of continuing encounters for the players.

For those wanting a low-money system, why? Have you played a few levels and encountered players with more money than they know what to do with? I'm not trying to be snide, 'cause I know it happened in 3e. I'm just going to give the 4e designers the benefit of the doubt before I house-rule it.

 

[theNater]

Does it help if we consider the world to have two economies: an adventurer economy and an "everybody else" economy?

The money that adventurers aquire comes from vast treasure hoards out in the wilderness, generally the remnants of the various empires that have risen and fallen. This is vastly more wealth than would be necessary to buy the contents of several cities. So what do the adventurers do with that cash?

Well, some of them use that money to buy a town, and retire to manage it. They put the rest of it into a vault somewhere to hire the services of(or be pilfered by) those still adventuring and life the good life. This is the retirement option.

But for those who want to continue adventuring and/or aquiring more treasure, buying towns is not particularly efficient. Sure, if you buy a town your investment will probably grow, but a relatively slow pace. But if you find another, larger treasure hoard, that's a mighty return. So how do you invest for that? By buying(hugely expensive) magic items.

As for the merchants, they're in essentially the same boat. Although for them, to continue working means using the money they got by selling a magic item to buy 5 or 6 new magic items, and try to sell those to other adventurers.

In all of these cases, it is pretty much nonsensical for adventurers to interact with normal-level finances at all. They just have too much money. There's nothing they can spend it all on except those powerful magic items.

 

[Serensius]

I think this sort of... economic balance for the monsters is in the hands of the DM. WotC is just suggesting how much cash they estimate PCs to have by what level... but as always, these are just guidelines.

The problem with this, of course, is that PCs are assumed to have a certain amount of items at any given level, and if they don't they might just end up being sub-par, thus breaking the system. At least, this was true for 3e, I'm personally hoping that it's been fixed for 4e, what with the guidelines for playing without the three "key" items and all. It seems character power isn't as tied into magic items as before.

EDIT:

In all of these cases, it is pretty much nonsensical for adventurers to interact with normal-level finances at all. They just have too much money. There's nothing they can spend it all on except those powerful magic items.

That's something I'd like to remove, personally. At least for the first 7-8 levels or so. I think, to truly enjoy being rich, you have to have been poor some time.

 

[Agamon]

It's pretty easy to houserule. I plan to run a low cash game for my first 4e campaign, I won't be keeping track of money at all. Figure the PCs can afford all mundane stuff. There won't be a market for ritual components, very few casters around, so the PCs have to acquire those themselves.

Yup, me too. In fact, in my game, there really won't be many places to buy stuff either (my points of light are more like microscopic motes). They'll find stuff occasionally and be able to barter with non-hostiles once in a while, but currency doesn't play a big role in most societies in my homebrew. I don't see the game suffering for it either. It's more of a survival game than a phat swag game.

 

[theNater]

I think, to truly enjoy being rich, you have to have been poor some time.

Can't argue with that!

 

[Zalgarde]

For those wanting a low-money system, why? Have you played a few levels and encountered players with more money than they know what to do with? I'm not trying to be snide, 'cause I know it happened in 3e. I'm just going to give the 4e designers the benefit of the doubt before I house-rule it.

I don't want to be 2 months in before I figure out whether the systems too rich or poor for our tastes and then have to give (or more likely take) stuff away. with money guidelines for all the items and treasure tables, I could scale them so they mesh with mundane life well enough to please me, I don't need a realistic economy necessarily... if armors cheap for its real life work, I can live with that till I get to it, as long as it doesn't make my pc's the richest men in all the land at level 7, or unable to hurt enemies because they dont' have a +(x) weapon.

 

[Andor]

I definitely saw it myself one time, when an evil druid realized that since gear merged into him when he wild shaped, he concocted a daring plan to sell some of it off and buy/"rescue" ALL the chickens in some 100 mile radius by hopping through trees and paying exhorbitant sums at each town in the area before anyone realized there were none the next town over.... all so he could release them into the depths of the nastiest forest around and cull the taint of weakness inflicted on the pitiful species of chickens by civilization (oh and starve a bunch of the people). and he was what level 8? level 9? in 3e. The situation looked like it was gonna eat a lot of otherwise fulfilling game time that everyone could be involved in, so the dm just said "No. You don't. Your character doesn't. The End" Which everyone was fine with, cause just explaining the plan had taken waaay to long.

Are you kidding? That's hilarious! I would love to see a player do that in my game. Was he counting the chickens as equipment? I don't think that works, but it's even funnier to imagine a bear transforming into a man in the middle of a giant exploding cloud of chickens. I don't know who that player was but buy him a coke for me, would you? *wanders off laughing*

 

[malraux]

I don't want to be 2 months in before I figure out whether the systems too rich or poor for our tastes and then have to give (or more likely take) stuff away. with money guidelines for all the items and treasure tables, I could scale them so they mesh with mundane life well enough to please me, I don't need a realistic economy necessarily... if armors cheap for its real life work, I can live with that till I get to it, as long as it doesn't make my pc's the richest men in all the land at level 7, or unable to hurt enemies because they dont' have a +(x) weapon.

I would expect pcs to reach "richest guys in the land" toward the end of heroic or the beginning of paragon, depending on how you define rich and land.