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<blockquote data-quote="Jack7" data-source="post: 5790041" data-attributes="member: 54707">One thing I'd really, really like to see in 5th Edition&nbsp; is the return of the Thief.&nbsp; &nbsp;The Rogue was to me an interesting NPC Class concept,&nbsp; but it was far too ambiguous and ineffective a character class, in my opinion, as&nbsp; either a Team Member, or as a Lone Operative. I am hopeful that 5E will herald&nbsp; the return of the Thief.&nbsp; &nbsp;The Thief to me, like the Ranger or the Barbarian, was&nbsp; both an excellent Team Operative and an excellent Lone Operative. A valuable&nbsp; character class that could be used in numerous ways and could achieve a wide&nbsp; number of objectives, both in-group and on his own.&nbsp; &nbsp;I very much look forward to the rebirth of the Sneaking&nbsp; Man. The Rogue to me was more of a dandy, and a sort of silk-laced bad boy. The&nbsp; Thief, by contrast, was a working man. A dangerous man. A dangerous man for a&nbsp; dangerous job. Far more fit for real adventuring and for grime and blood and&nbsp; chill nights of dark surveillance, than the Rogue, who was more fit for the&nbsp; theatre and the tavern hall.If I'm to infiltrate a dangerous enemy camp,&nbsp; much less a potentially monster filled set of ruins, I want a dangerous survivor&nbsp; and ambusher, I don't want a fancy dresser and a good talker. I want a man who&nbsp; knows the enemy and where to cut him, not a man who critiques the enemy and is a&nbsp; professional negotiator. (Although negotiation has its rewards and is a useful&nbsp; capability, it's of little use in a either a street fight, or a fight with&nbsp; cut-throats and monsters.)&nbsp; &nbsp;For that I'd much rather have a thief. The Rogue can&nbsp; size up strangers in the beer-hall. I'll pay him for his opinion. In the field&nbsp; though I want a man who can kill, who can sneak, survive, run an informant,&nbsp; infiltrate, and hamstring the Ogre. Him I want with me.&nbsp; &nbsp;The Rogue always struck me as the urban ne'er-do-well,&nbsp; knave, and scoundrel. The Thief as deadly and cunning.&nbsp; &nbsp;Some of the things I naturally think the thief should be&nbsp; good at and that I'd like to see the thief intrinsically good at include&nbsp; thievery (of course), burglary, robbery, forgery (and crime in general), ambush,&nbsp; stealth and sneaking, escape and evasion, analysis of dangerous situations&nbsp; (danger sense), traps (setting and disarming), locating hidden things,&nbsp; espionage, infiltration, disguise and cover stories, scouting (a Ranger would be&nbsp; good at many of these things as well, but in a different way and for different&nbsp; effects and reasons), street and dirty fighting, survival, vadding, hiding,&nbsp; covert interrogation and questioning, manhunting (not tracking so much as&nbsp; tracing men and their habits), surveillance and casing victims and places, and tool&nbsp; use.&nbsp; &nbsp;Do you wish to see the Return of the Thief, and if so&nbsp; what do you think he/she should be good at? What do you want out of your&nbsp; Sneaking Man?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Jack7, post: 5790041, member: 54707"] [FONT=Verdana]One thing I'd really, really like to see in 5th Edition is the return of the Thief.[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana]The Rogue was to me an interesting NPC Class concept, but it was far too ambiguous and ineffective a character class, in my opinion, as either a Team Member, or as a Lone Operative. I am hopeful that 5E will herald the return of the Thief.[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana]The Thief to me, like the Ranger or the Barbarian, was both an excellent Team Operative and an excellent Lone Operative. A valuable character class that could be used in numerous ways and could achieve a wide number of objectives, both in-group and on his own.[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana]I very much look forward to the rebirth of the Sneaking Man. The Rogue to me was more of a dandy, and a sort of silk-laced bad boy. The Thief, by contrast, was a working man. A dangerous man. A dangerous man for a dangerous job. Far more fit for real adventuring and for grime and blood and chill nights of dark surveillance, than the Rogue, who was more fit for the theatre and the tavern hall. If I'm to infiltrate a dangerous enemy camp, much less a potentially monster filled set of ruins, I want a dangerous survivor and ambusher, I don't want a fancy dresser and a good talker. I want a man who knows the enemy and where to cut him, not a man who critiques the enemy and is a professional negotiator. (Although negotiation has its rewards and is a useful capability, it's of little use in a either a street fight, or a fight with cut-throats and monsters.)[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana]For that I'd much rather have a thief. The Rogue can size up strangers in the beer-hall. I'll pay him for his opinion. In the field though I want a man who can kill, who can sneak, survive, run an informant, infiltrate, and hamstring the Ogre. Him I want with me.[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana]The Rogue always struck me as the urban ne'er-do-well, knave, and scoundrel. The Thief as deadly and cunning.[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana]Some of the things I naturally think the thief should be good at and that I'd like to see the thief intrinsically good at include thievery (of course), burglary, robbery, forgery (and crime in general), ambush, stealth and sneaking, escape and evasion, analysis of dangerous situations (danger sense), traps (setting and disarming), locating hidden things, espionage, infiltration, disguise and cover stories, scouting (a Ranger would be good at many of these things as well, but in a different way and for different effects and reasons), street and dirty fighting, survival, vadding, hiding, covert interrogation and questioning, manhunting (not tracking so much as tracing men and their habits), surveillance and casing victims and places, and tool use.[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana]Do you wish to see the Return of the Thief, and if so what do you think he/she should be good at? What do you want out of your Sneaking Man?[/FONT] [/QUOTE]

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