D&D 5E The RPG or the Brand?

[Mishihari Lord]

Elminster, Raistlin, Drizzt, Vecna, von Zarovich, Tiamat, Lloth, Soth ... there's plenty. Lots of D&D books hit the bestseller charts over the years; people read them. Who knew about about Star Lord before GotG? I didn't! I didn't even really know about Iron Man before Marvel lucked out with Robert Downey Jr., which is what launched their current trajectory. I'd never heard of Black Widow or Hawkeye.

And those are pre-existing characters. It's perfectly possible to launch and succeed with a brand new character. All characters were new once. Jason Bourne was brand new. So was Jack Bauer. Felicity Smoak is a new DC character launched by the Arrow show, and now in the comics.

Luck and marketing. Though I might have said that a few times already....

Marvel led with Spiderman and DC led with Batman and Superman, whom most non-geeks know. Once they had established that they could make movies worth watching they moved on to the minor characters. This was good marketing, not much luck. D&D doesn't have any characters of such stature.

 

[Morrus]

And you may be right, but it really is a shot in the dark. What makes Elminster any different than Gandalf or Dumbledore in the eyes of the general public?

Luck and marketing.

I should just save those words to clipboard and ctrl-v. It'll be a lot quicker!

 

[delericho]

Just give them cars to drive around in anyway.

They could be closely associated with the Apparatus of Kwalish.

Heh.

Unfortunately, by 'cars' I didn't mean "four wheels, an engine, goes fast" - a lot of the interest, especially in Asia, seems to be tied to the specific cars shown. And I think including those would be a bridge too far.

 

[Mirtek]

Oh, they'd still own the D&D brand and they'd be coupling it with many other strong brands through such a licensing scheme, as with Star Wars (e.g. Harry Potter RPG using the D&D game engine, etc.).

What would that do for those other brands though? Why should they couple with D&D? The Harry Potter fans wanting a Harry Potter RPG wouldn't give a damn about whether it's based in D&D or has it's own engine.

Once they had established that they could make movies worth watching they moved on to the minor characters.

That's the point. People didn't watch GotG beause of Starlord, they couldn't care less about whoever was the lead. They watched it because they liked the last movie enough, that they gave credit to Marvel no matter who they had put in their new movie

 

[Uchawi]

Of course this would all be a lot easier if we went back 30 years and D&D was the only game on the block. But in present times they have to appeal to a diverse audience, and what will provide a spark to get us all to buy-in is going to be something new with a heavy dose of luck. In that sense I do not think FR is the final solution. I was one of the individuals that bought the dragon lance series and books. I did that one more time with Dark Sun.

As to releasing more splat books being an error of omission, the same thing can be stated for errata. And even if the core three books sell well just based on curiosity for established RPG players or new ones, something else needs to add fuel to the mix to sustain it.

 

[Sailor Moon]

What would that do for those other brands though? Why should they couple with D&D? The Harry Potter fans wanting a Harry Potter RPG wouldn't give a damn about whether it's based in D&D or has it's own engine.
That's the point. People didn't watch GotG beause of Starlord, they couldn't care less about whoever was the lead. They watched it because they liked the last movie enough, that they gave credit to Marvel no matter who they had put in their new movie

As well as the fact they made sure GoTg had the Marvel logo displayed with in sight easily. If it wasn't a Marvel product, I don't think it would have done as well.

 

[Mark CMG]

I think you know the answers to these questions but . . .

What would that do for those other brands though?

Potentially, whatever it has done for Star Wars, for good or for ill.

Why should they couple with D&D?

Most licensing begins because someone has a property and wants to make some money off of that property. Further, there is an area in which money can be made but in which they have no in-house expertise. Finally, since D&D is the top brand in the world (by many orders of magnitude), associating with D&D has many upsides if you plan to license in the RPG sector: the aforementioned expertise, market knowledge and share, etc.

The Harry Potter fans wanting a Harry Potter RPG wouldn't give a damn about whether it's based in D&D or has it's own engine.

Well, technically, by my suggestion, D&D and the supposed HP RPG would both be using the same underlying engine. I just called it the D&D engine for shorthand. However, you raise an interesting point. Some HP fans wouldn't want an RPG, some wouldn't care where it came from, and some might even hate the very idea of it's association with D&D as you seem to do, sight unseen, shaking their fists in the air at the very thought of it and cursing both the sky and any who wander beneath it with the words "HP-D&D Licensing scheme" upon their foul lips. Now that you have raised doubts by questioning the idea, I am ashamed for having brought it up.

 

[Sailor Moon]

Well, technically, by my suggestion, D&D and the supposed HP RPG would both be using the same underlying engine. I just called it the D&D engine for shorthand. However, you raise an interesting point. Some HP fans wouldn't want an RPG, some wouldn't care where it came from, and some might even hate the very idea of it's association with D&D as you seem to do, sight unseen, shaking their fists in the air at the very thought of it and cursing both the sky and any who wander beneath it with the words "HP-D&D Licensing scheme" upon their foul lips. Now that you have raised doubts by questioning the idea, I am ashamed for having brought it up.

This is was already done with the D20 system. Remember Elric, Cthuhlu, and World of Darkness d20?

Unless Wizards of the Coast make the rules available for everyone else to use, they are not going to partner up with another IP such as Harry Potter. You would be splitting your own product with a potential rival taking profits away from D&D. Now even if it didn't matter which got the profits, you would still have to give the HP IP a percentage of the profits as well as D&D.

It's not a smart move and I wouldn't see it happening.

 

[Mark CMG]

This is was already done with the D20 system.

Yes, in a way, and very successfully, in an open licensing scheme. Note the examples you give were built on that engine by outside parties. My suggestion here is that since WotC wishes to scale back the release schedule for D&D, they could keep their RPG division busy licensing properties from other large IP franchises and making RPGs of them using the underlying, dare I say it, D&D RPG game engine. Of course, in the d20 Era it was outside entities leveraging the d20 engine with other IP (Green Ronin, Mongoose, etc.) and the IP they could secure didn't include the very largest such as Harry Potter. I think WotC could manage to get some of that and fashion a deal that benefits both parties. Of course, when you're a little RPG guy and you're trying to get someone's IP under license, you don't bring the same gravitas to the table as the D&D IP owners.

You would be splitting your own product with a potential rival taking profits away from D&D. Now even if it didn't matter which got the profits, you would still have to give the HP IP a percentage of the profits as well as D&D.


It's not a smart move and I wouldn't see it happening.

What you suggest as a downside is akin to a shirt manufacturer not wanting to make multiple colors of shirt because selling blue shirts will limit the number of red shirts they might sell. Or that same shirt maker not wanting to have shirts with Sailor Moon and shirts with Iron Man because they compete with one another and with their own red and blue shirts. It's a bad argument and not really an issue.

 

[Mirtek]

and the IP they could secure didn't include the very largest such as Harry Potter.

You mean except Star Wars?

Of course, when you're a little RPG guy and you're trying to get someone's IP under license, you don't bring the same gravitas to the table as the D&D IP owners.

Which would be benefitable to the IP holder, since that means a better deal and more controll for him. It's not as if the D&D enginge would really increase sales of a HP RPG much beyond what it would sell with any other engine.

An own engine also has the advantage of being able to be customized to the IP. With the D20 versions it was a bitter pill to swallow because the D20 market was so big that using an unsuited enginge was still more feasible at the end. And even then many D20 version enventually included so many alterations as to be hardly recognizable.