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The Thug, A Subclass for Strength Rogues
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<blockquote data-quote="Cap'n Kobold" data-source="post: 7595398" data-attributes="member: 6802951"><p>As has been pointed out a couple of times, there is only one Rogue class feature that actually uses Dex specifically. The Sneak Attacks from a melee rogue do not require Dex, just specific weapons that can use Str just as well.</p><p>In combat, I can see this class behaving very much like any other melee-oriented rogue, pulling off Sneak Attacks as the meat of their contribution but with more tactical maneuvering of opponents vie shoving and grappling.</p><p></p><p> Character fantasy and concept is probably the main impetus for this subclass. The image of the more athletic criminal, still relying on dirty fighting, but viciously clubbing foes down with a sap or chair leg, rather than the more graceful but less physically capable sneak poking with a rapier.</p><p></p><p> It sounds like you are not only assigning less pleasant motives to someone who has already told you that they are not the case, you are basing these accusations upon your personal opinions about some of the class features.</p><p>You seem to have a very . . . specific image in your mind about Sneak Attack for example, that is supported by neither some other people's opinions, nor the rules themselves.</p><p>You claimed that the motives for designing the class were an underhanded attempt at maximising damage despite it probably not dealing any more damage than a Dex-based rogue.</p><p></p><p>Now me? I wouldn't need this subclass because I just flat-out removed the finesse requirement for Sneak Attack anyway. In my game a Str-based rogue can fight dirty with a club or a longsword anyway. I don't generally allow Intimidation to work with Str anyway, although I'm pretty flexible with swapping abilities and proficiencies around in general.</p><p>And as written, with the exception of some of their potential available proficiencies, the Rogue only has one class ability that actually keys off Dex, and even a Rogue with an emphasis on Str is unlikely to dump Dex completely given how powerful Dex is in combat.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Cap'n Kobold, post: 7595398, member: 6802951"] As has been pointed out a couple of times, there is only one Rogue class feature that actually uses Dex specifically. The Sneak Attacks from a melee rogue do not require Dex, just specific weapons that can use Str just as well. In combat, I can see this class behaving very much like any other melee-oriented rogue, pulling off Sneak Attacks as the meat of their contribution but with more tactical maneuvering of opponents vie shoving and grappling. Character fantasy and concept is probably the main impetus for this subclass. The image of the more athletic criminal, still relying on dirty fighting, but viciously clubbing foes down with a sap or chair leg, rather than the more graceful but less physically capable sneak poking with a rapier. It sounds like you are not only assigning less pleasant motives to someone who has already told you that they are not the case, you are basing these accusations upon your personal opinions about some of the class features. You seem to have a very . . . specific image in your mind about Sneak Attack for example, that is supported by neither some other people's opinions, nor the rules themselves. You claimed that the motives for designing the class were an underhanded attempt at maximising damage despite it probably not dealing any more damage than a Dex-based rogue. Now me? I wouldn't need this subclass because I just flat-out removed the finesse requirement for Sneak Attack anyway. In my game a Str-based rogue can fight dirty with a club or a longsword anyway. I don't generally allow Intimidation to work with Str anyway, although I'm pretty flexible with swapping abilities and proficiencies around in general. And as written, with the exception of some of their potential available proficiencies, the Rogue only has one class ability that actually keys off Dex, and even a Rogue with an emphasis on Str is unlikely to dump Dex completely given how powerful Dex is in combat. [/QUOTE]
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