Theories of magic IYC
- Thread starter Quickleaf
- Start date
Had the same idea in the setting I created with an old college buddy. The master terraforming system was called ORACLE, from "Ongoing Reorganization and Adaptation of CLimatic Elements". The biological factory designed to stock the new ecosystem with Earth-normal species was E.L.L., from "Earth Life Library", conviently built into the side of a mountain the colonists named Shaddai, thus making it "ELL-Shaddai".drnuncheon said:
The Bible of the post-collapse religion began with the line "I am the Eye of the Oracle of Ell. Hear my words and prepare!". The actual words spoken to the hermit who discovered the ancient terminal half-buried in a mountian cave were "I am an A.I. of the ORACLE system at E.L.L. Can you hear me? Help me prepare for a partial ststem restart."
We figured that the original colonial authority chose those names as a joke, a way of messing with their descendents should civilization actually collapse...
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Tonguez
A suffusion of yellow
Mallus said:
Was also an idea I used once, 'borrowed' from an episode of Galaxy Rangers (when they visited a planet were the people used magic devices and discovered a huge bio-computer needing repair)
Anyway my theories
1. In the beginning the creator sang the universe into being and so all things are but vibrations within the High Song of Creation. The gods are manifestations of Song able to maintain its rhythm and to channel this through their clerics. Arcane Magic on the other hand is about creating new 'vibrations' to manipulate the High Song - this is why spells can be cast in different languages, the specific words are irrelevant only the 'tones' matter for they set up various vibrations which may be alterd by certain gestures and focused through different materials.
2. There is no Arcane Magic only Divine, Scorcerers (no Wizards in that campaign) are those who deal with 'demons' calling upon them (who often manifest as a small animal familiar) to cast magic in their favour.
NB I really like your Associative Magic idea - yoinked
Quickleaf
Legend
Thanks! Keep the great responses coming. Another idea I've had is that mages create magic that has never been seen before, and once the spell is created it gradually becomes woven into the fabric of reality in some way. Once woven firmly into reality, the spell cannot be accessed by wizards anymore, becoming part of the world or (in some cases) adopted by a god. Thus wizards are known as "minds of constant activity" because they must constantly create new spells. Only the most powerful of mages can call upon spells that are already woven into reality. The mage doesn't just alter the specific situation, but all foreseeable like situations. For example...
The mage Arcturus is riding his horse pursued by a pack of wolves summoned by his archenemy. Arcturus realizes that the wolves are running him toward a pit trap. He whispers a spell that causes earth to fill in the pit trap, just before his horse gallops over it. Over the next few days, pit traps in the local area get filled in as the earth collapses upon the open space. After a few weeks, pit traps all over the nation are filled in. The earth begins to abhor a vaccum, and several caverns collapse in the area in which the spell was cast. Old wells all of a sudden become filled in. The king wants to know why the trenches he dug for his troops collapsed. After a month or so, Arcturus finds he can no longer call upon the spell at will -- it has become imbedded in reality. While he may benefit from the tendency of the earth to fill in small dug-out spaces in the future, he cannot fill in a pit trap as he did before. The spell is no longer the province of wizardry; it now belongs to something greater.
Drnuncheon, that is a cool idea. How did the adventure turn out?
Eberron was made from a primeval dragon? Maybe I *should* check it out.
The mage Arcturus is riding his horse pursued by a pack of wolves summoned by his archenemy. Arcturus realizes that the wolves are running him toward a pit trap. He whispers a spell that causes earth to fill in the pit trap, just before his horse gallops over it. Over the next few days, pit traps in the local area get filled in as the earth collapses upon the open space. After a few weeks, pit traps all over the nation are filled in. The earth begins to abhor a vaccum, and several caverns collapse in the area in which the spell was cast. Old wells all of a sudden become filled in. The king wants to know why the trenches he dug for his troops collapsed. After a month or so, Arcturus finds he can no longer call upon the spell at will -- it has become imbedded in reality. While he may benefit from the tendency of the earth to fill in small dug-out spaces in the future, he cannot fill in a pit trap as he did before. The spell is no longer the province of wizardry; it now belongs to something greater.
Drnuncheon, that is a cool idea. How did the adventure turn out?
Eberron was made from a primeval dragon? Maybe I *should* check it out.
Ferret
Explorer
In my own little world, The Source (magic) runs through the world in a big stream, flowing through the 'gods' for a lack of a better term which each of the 'divine' casters, one for each 'god' can pick up and cast. The 'wizards' in the world prepare magic by safely channaling it into items, or focuses, and cast them out of them. The Sorcerers draw magic directly from the The Souce, which is very dangerous but can fling of more spells like that.
Magic IMC comes from the Ætherium (also known as the spirit realm, the Other World, and many other names).
Mortals can draw on the Ætherium, and attempt to shape it to their will. It is very dangerous to do so unaided, as the Ætherium is not easily contained, and there are hungry things lurking in the depths. Over countless centuries the mortal races have developed rituals and practices that allow mortals to call on the Ætherium (in relative safety).
There is no arcane/divine divide IMC, all casters draw from the same source (even if they are not aware of it). Those who base their sorcery on logic are usually called Wizards, while those who base their sorcery on faith are called mystics. As the Ætherium is shaped by thought the spells developed by wizards and mystics differ (which is why many believe that there is a difference between arcane and divine magic).
The mortal races have further divide magic into "spheres" or "schools" which contain similar spells. The most common spheres are Light and Dark, and though wizards and mystics can practice both the sphere of Light is dominated by mystics while the sphere of Dark is dominated by wizards (often referred to as warlocks). Other spheres include Elemental (dominated by mystics), Enchantment (also known as alchemy, dominated by wizards), as well as Rune (which is dominated by neither style).
It should also be noted that the Ætherium can be influenced through force of will alone, but that in order to do so one must have a powerful personality. In some ways this is the most common form of magic, as it requires far less training then the other two, but it is also very limited in scope. Most commonly developed by warriors it is referred to as "the swordsman spirit" or simply "Ki".
Where do gods, spirits, and daemons fall in this system?
Gods are divided up into two main groups, the Mortal Gods and the Old Ones. Mortal Gods are those often worshiped by mortal creatures; they "exist" in the traditional D&D sense, but instead are a manifestation of the beliefs of a nation/culture. The Old Ones (also refered to as the Ancient Gods or the Titans) are actual living enities with their own wants and ambitions; they are often strange and terrible beings, not being bound by the beliefs and morals of mortals. Some can act benevolently, while others are malign in the extreme.
Most Daemons are simply manifestations of the dark emotions of mortals, while others can be ancient and powerful gods. Spirits are similar, manifestaions of the spiritual energy in a place or around an event. Most such creatures are barely sentient, drivien completly by what ever emotion created them.
Mortals can draw on the Ætherium, and attempt to shape it to their will. It is very dangerous to do so unaided, as the Ætherium is not easily contained, and there are hungry things lurking in the depths. Over countless centuries the mortal races have developed rituals and practices that allow mortals to call on the Ætherium (in relative safety).
There is no arcane/divine divide IMC, all casters draw from the same source (even if they are not aware of it). Those who base their sorcery on logic are usually called Wizards, while those who base their sorcery on faith are called mystics. As the Ætherium is shaped by thought the spells developed by wizards and mystics differ (which is why many believe that there is a difference between arcane and divine magic).
The mortal races have further divide magic into "spheres" or "schools" which contain similar spells. The most common spheres are Light and Dark, and though wizards and mystics can practice both the sphere of Light is dominated by mystics while the sphere of Dark is dominated by wizards (often referred to as warlocks). Other spheres include Elemental (dominated by mystics), Enchantment (also known as alchemy, dominated by wizards), as well as Rune (which is dominated by neither style).
It should also be noted that the Ætherium can be influenced through force of will alone, but that in order to do so one must have a powerful personality. In some ways this is the most common form of magic, as it requires far less training then the other two, but it is also very limited in scope. Most commonly developed by warriors it is referred to as "the swordsman spirit" or simply "Ki".
Where do gods, spirits, and daemons fall in this system?
Gods are divided up into two main groups, the Mortal Gods and the Old Ones. Mortal Gods are those often worshiped by mortal creatures; they "exist" in the traditional D&D sense, but instead are a manifestation of the beliefs of a nation/culture. The Old Ones (also refered to as the Ancient Gods or the Titans) are actual living enities with their own wants and ambitions; they are often strange and terrible beings, not being bound by the beliefs and morals of mortals. Some can act benevolently, while others are malign in the extreme.
Most Daemons are simply manifestations of the dark emotions of mortals, while others can be ancient and powerful gods. Spirits are similar, manifestaions of the spiritual energy in a place or around an event. Most such creatures are barely sentient, drivien completly by what ever emotion created them.
drnuncheon
Explorer
Buttercup said:
It's perpetually on my "to read" list - I couldn't get into it the last time I tried.
Quickleaf said:
In brief: the party's chief foe, a necromancer trying to break the wall of death (there was no resurrection due to a systems malfunction) actually managed to do so, but one of the party members who died with him in the process was also reborn in the City of the Dead (actually a cloning facility with a 'soul collector', a la Farmer's Riverworld series). The rest of the party tracked them down and eventually wound up in a battle with the Webmistress, the chief evil deity of the campaign, who was actually one of the original colonists cybernetically linked into the computer network and kept alive through nanotechnology. They managed to replace her with the colonist who was originally responsible for the destruction of civilization.
Whew.
...
You know, it kind of begs for a sequel, if we weren't scattered halfway across the US.
J
VoiceOfReason?
First Post
IMC I use a blanket 'ley line' theory-when details of a campaign setting don't call for a different magic source obviously.
Basically the ley lines are veins of primal power (in the form of light, life, the elements, force, and about a dozen other classifications) that flow through nearly all of the planes in a state of raw, unfocused, and relatively useless magical power. The ley lines are invisable to all but the gods, and generally don't respond to anything that's in phase with the plane they're on. Magic is made when 2 or more ley lines intersect at the same point in space or when they are cut. Arcane magic cuts ley lines (which eventually heal, but if enough powerful arcane magic is used in a location, its ley lines will eventually dry up) through the use of words and motions of power that the ley lines do respond to, while divine magic is simply a prayer to the priest's source of power, who then intervenes on their behalf and moves ley lines through divine will to intersect in such a way as to produce the requested spell.
I had a custom PrC called Ley Weaver with very limited spellcasting abilities but with the power to manipulate ley lines to counter or manipulate other spells, or to generate base magical effects (like spewing a gout of magical fire with a random area of effect at a variable distance, or generating a mass of Force to toss friends or foes)
Basically the ley lines are veins of primal power (in the form of light, life, the elements, force, and about a dozen other classifications) that flow through nearly all of the planes in a state of raw, unfocused, and relatively useless magical power. The ley lines are invisable to all but the gods, and generally don't respond to anything that's in phase with the plane they're on. Magic is made when 2 or more ley lines intersect at the same point in space or when they are cut. Arcane magic cuts ley lines (which eventually heal, but if enough powerful arcane magic is used in a location, its ley lines will eventually dry up) through the use of words and motions of power that the ley lines do respond to, while divine magic is simply a prayer to the priest's source of power, who then intervenes on their behalf and moves ley lines through divine will to intersect in such a way as to produce the requested spell.
I had a custom PrC called Ley Weaver with very limited spellcasting abilities but with the power to manipulate ley lines to counter or manipulate other spells, or to generate base magical effects (like spewing a gout of magical fire with a random area of effect at a variable distance, or generating a mass of Force to toss friends or foes)
Commonblade
First Post
Arcane power is like a person moving tumblers in a lock. If you do the right combination you cause the universe to bend around you. Wizards study the combinations to unlocking this bend. Sorcerers simply "see" the way it should be done.
Divine spellcasting is believed to be granted from the gods, but in truth is simply the power of belief from the wielder. They power all of their spells on the belief in themselves and their actions.
Bards dance the fine line. They believe that the world can change and use thier will and finesses to cause it to bend to thier belief.
Psions are pychic, drawing in the spark of creation that exist in all of us.
Divine spellcasting is believed to be granted from the gods, but in truth is simply the power of belief from the wielder. They power all of their spells on the belief in themselves and their actions.
Bards dance the fine line. They believe that the world can change and use thier will and finesses to cause it to bend to thier belief.
Psions are pychic, drawing in the spark of creation that exist in all of us.
AdmundfortGeographer
Getting lost in fantasy maps
I had something very similar to a setup arscott had for my own home brew.
The multiverse is suffused with energies far too potent for mortals to handle. In the distant past mortals once knew how but the results were far too drastic. The immortals are unable to control the energies themselves, so they instead created a barrier preventing mortals from drawing upon the energies directly.
The immortals themselves allowed their own followers to draw upon their own limitless divine essence to power magic. The immortals knew that due to their own limits, they couldn't prevent mortals from finding ways to bypass the barrier. So they then began instructing their followers on how mortals could tap through the limiting barrier and not have total access to unlimited power. As long as mortals would draw energy through the barrier, the immortals believe there is little danger mortals could once again threaten the balance of the multiverse. To bypass the barrier, immortals taught mortals on drawing energy through living things. All living things by their nature have a supernatural connection to realm of the divine.
(Note: this world is essentially my own creation of the world that precedes what Dark Sun becomes. I have my own pre-history development that ditches the published history and timeline. So, this effectively describes "preserving". Mortals haven't learned "defiling", yet . . ..)
In this way, there are some schools of "Spiritual" mages. Each is an arcane class with its own finite spell list. Each list of spells tailored narrowly along certain interests of important immortals. Available to PCs are the "spiritual" arcane spell lists of Nature (mostly animal, wood, and earth), Savant (mostly divinations, law, and force), Sea (mostly water, sea animals, and wind), Song (mostly sonic, charm, and conjuring), and Storm (mostly electrical, weather, and chaos). Some intrepid mortals are secretly experimenting with new ways of combining "scientific" principles with the newly ways of drawing energy. Thus there are the "science" spell lists of Alchemy (pretty self explanatory), Geometry (symbols, line, runes, numerology), and Mindbending (the seer and telepath psion class). There are some other prestige classes exclusive to casters who chose a "science" spell list.
Needless to say, there have been some malign entities who are trying to subvert the Immortal's barrier and restore their previous unimpeded connection to mortal spellcasters. These are the "Lost Paths" of arcane magic. Many of these schools require the mortal to make a pact with a supernatural entity and then get access to a single spell list. Each Path is its own spell list. There are Paths of Elemental Air, Elemental Earth, Elemental Fire, and Elemental Water, each of these Paths require a pact with an elemental lord. There is the Lost Path of Hedge Magic, the spellcaster makes a pact with a fey spirit. The Lost Path of Fiendseeking, spellcasters are called warlocks (with the new warlock class, this is made easy for me) who make a pact with evil outsiders, demon or devil. There is the Lost Path of the Deathmaster, a necromancer who has a pact with an ancient incorporeal undead entity. There is the Lost Path of Ever Cold, a spellcaster who has a pact with an supremely powerful mortal entity who couldn't be killed, so he who was imprisoned in a cold dimension. Cold mages have learned to pierce the dimensional prison enough to establish a psychic connection to the entity. There is the Lost Path of Shadow, spellcasters who have made a pact to sacrifice portions of their material form to a shadow entity so as to draw energy from Shadow.
Needless to say, every arcane spellcaster has a dedicated spell list. Each spellcaster draws energy from specific and defined energy sources. With the plethora of d20 sources out there, it has been very easy to recreate these old 2nd ed. inventions of mine as 3e versions.
I have a future-history planned out that will take this system towards Dark Sun's status quo tens of thousands of game years later.
Regards,
Eric Anondson
The multiverse is suffused with energies far too potent for mortals to handle. In the distant past mortals once knew how but the results were far too drastic. The immortals are unable to control the energies themselves, so they instead created a barrier preventing mortals from drawing upon the energies directly.
The immortals themselves allowed their own followers to draw upon their own limitless divine essence to power magic. The immortals knew that due to their own limits, they couldn't prevent mortals from finding ways to bypass the barrier. So they then began instructing their followers on how mortals could tap through the limiting barrier and not have total access to unlimited power. As long as mortals would draw energy through the barrier, the immortals believe there is little danger mortals could once again threaten the balance of the multiverse. To bypass the barrier, immortals taught mortals on drawing energy through living things. All living things by their nature have a supernatural connection to realm of the divine.
(Note: this world is essentially my own creation of the world that precedes what Dark Sun becomes. I have my own pre-history development that ditches the published history and timeline. So, this effectively describes "preserving". Mortals haven't learned "defiling", yet . . ..)
In this way, there are some schools of "Spiritual" mages. Each is an arcane class with its own finite spell list. Each list of spells tailored narrowly along certain interests of important immortals. Available to PCs are the "spiritual" arcane spell lists of Nature (mostly animal, wood, and earth), Savant (mostly divinations, law, and force), Sea (mostly water, sea animals, and wind), Song (mostly sonic, charm, and conjuring), and Storm (mostly electrical, weather, and chaos). Some intrepid mortals are secretly experimenting with new ways of combining "scientific" principles with the newly ways of drawing energy. Thus there are the "science" spell lists of Alchemy (pretty self explanatory), Geometry (symbols, line, runes, numerology), and Mindbending (the seer and telepath psion class). There are some other prestige classes exclusive to casters who chose a "science" spell list.
Needless to say, there have been some malign entities who are trying to subvert the Immortal's barrier and restore their previous unimpeded connection to mortal spellcasters. These are the "Lost Paths" of arcane magic. Many of these schools require the mortal to make a pact with a supernatural entity and then get access to a single spell list. Each Path is its own spell list. There are Paths of Elemental Air, Elemental Earth, Elemental Fire, and Elemental Water, each of these Paths require a pact with an elemental lord. There is the Lost Path of Hedge Magic, the spellcaster makes a pact with a fey spirit. The Lost Path of Fiendseeking, spellcasters are called warlocks (with the new warlock class, this is made easy for me) who make a pact with evil outsiders, demon or devil. There is the Lost Path of the Deathmaster, a necromancer who has a pact with an ancient incorporeal undead entity. There is the Lost Path of Ever Cold, a spellcaster who has a pact with an supremely powerful mortal entity who couldn't be killed, so he who was imprisoned in a cold dimension. Cold mages have learned to pierce the dimensional prison enough to establish a psychic connection to the entity. There is the Lost Path of Shadow, spellcasters who have made a pact to sacrifice portions of their material form to a shadow entity so as to draw energy from Shadow.
Needless to say, every arcane spellcaster has a dedicated spell list. Each spellcaster draws energy from specific and defined energy sources. With the plethora of d20 sources out there, it has been very easy to recreate these old 2nd ed. inventions of mine as 3e versions.
I have a future-history planned out that will take this system towards Dark Sun's status quo tens of thousands of game years later.
Regards,
Eric Anondson
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