D&D 5E (2024) Thoughts on Infinite Staircase?

[Zardnaar]

Yep. No, the issue is that it seems like the pharaoh’s ghost would just keep on walking non-stop, but the text says he arrives at the pyramid “the next evening”. That to me suggests a whole day of walking (or close to it).

Con DC starts at 11. If you walk for 24 hours after you’ve already walked for 8 hours, then by the time you finish, the DC will be 34. I think that would probably auto-kill most PCs (as many won’t be able to succeed on Con saves with DCs higher than 22 or so).

I think with that in mind, I’ll have to have Amun Sa stop and wait for the PCs while they sleep.

Or make it so the pyramid is closer and they come across his ghost during the day and then find the pyramid that same night (before they need to sleep). That would result in fewer forced march rolls.

I almost killed a party with 6 saves vs exhaustion.

It spirals flunked first save or two theyre the critical ones.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

New question about Pharaoh. The text seems to indicate that the PCs wander around aimlessly for two days before Amun Sa appears. He tells them his story then turns and starts walking toward his pyramid. It says he reaches the pyramid the following evening. Since he is a ghost and is more or less on autopilot, I presume he doesn’t stop (and wouldn’t stop if the PCs do).

So the PCs will have already spent a day traveling (unless they just sat around all day) and will then have to spend another ~ 24 hours walking through the desert to reach the pyramid. This means ~ 24 Con saves to avoid exhaustion from walking for more than 8 hours (plus a Con save to avoid exhaustion from not sleeping) in addition to any potential Con saves from the extreme heat.

Does that sound reasonable for 8th level PCs or is that too much? I mean, they only need to fail 6 times (or fewer if they already have exhaustion levels) to die of exhaustion.

Should I have the ghost stop and wait while they sleep overnight?

I think this is changed from the original. I haven’t looked at it for a long time, but it had a wilderness hex map with a bunch of encounters. The ghost would appear when the party approached within a few miles of the pyramid and point the party in the right direction. They didn’t need to follow it.

If I was running this adventure I would restore the wilderness section, or if using the Infinite Staircase, deposit the PCs within sight of the pyramid.

If the PCs are following the ghost, and lose sight of it, I would just have it reappear the next day.

 

[pukunui]

I think this is changed from the original. I haven’t looked at it for a long time, but it had a wilderness hex map with a bunch of encounters. The ghost would appear when the party approached within a few miles of the pyramid and point the party in the right direction. They didn’t need to follow it.

Just looking at the original.

The wilderness hex map has no scale, but the text talks about humans being able to cross a hex in 2 hours at their normal 12" speed. Using 5e's travel pace rules, that would make each hex 6 miles across. There are four points on the map (labeled 'J') where the PCs can encounter Amun-re's ghost. These are all 4-5 hexes from the pyramid's hex, so approximately 24-30 miles away. A PC can travel 24 miles in one day at a normal pace. So that seems to be in keeping with the 5e version.

The text also reads: "A solitary man in rags appears over the crest of a hill only 100 yards* away ... He will not be able to notice the party until they are within 15 meters*, at which time he will turn and address the party directly ... then turn and walk exactly in the direction of area 11, the pyramid and temple ... Amun-re will not communicate more than the words in Lore.

"Lore: Amun-re will recite these words when he encounters the party. He will continue to do this each evening until the party is within sight of the pyramid, when he will stop and slowly raise his arm up to point towards the ancient tomb."

So neither version addresses whether the ghostly pharaoh stops walking if the PCs stop. It's just that in the original, he repeats his speech every evening (which I guess would only come up if the players decide not to follow him and wander off somewhere else?), whereas in the 5e version he'll repeat his speech any time someone tries talking to him.

*As an aside, why does the module use both Imperial and Metric measurements?

If I was running this adventure I would restore the wilderness section, or if using the Infinite Staircase, deposit the PCs within sight of the pyramid.

If the PCs are following the ghost, and lose sight of it, I would just have it reappear the next day.

The wilderness section looks fun. It's tempting to include it since my party includes a ranger, and the player might like to have a chance to shine in the wilderness instead of me just handwaving it. But I dunno. It's also tempting to handwave it so we can get to the pyramid faster! Hmm.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

So neither version addresses whether the ghostly pharaoh stops walking if the PCs stop

It implies that the ghost just moves off in the direction of the pyramid at a pace faster than the PCs can follow (having delivered its message, ghost exits stage left). It supposes that once the party have the direction they will be able to stick to a straight course. They don’t need to literally follow the ghost.

 

[pukunui]

It implies that the ghost just moves off in the direction of the pyramid at a pace faster than the PCs can follow. It supposes that once the party have the direction they will be able to stick to a straight course. They don’t need to literally follow the ghost.

I suppose so. And then when they get there, they find him waiting for them so he can gesture at the pyramid before turning and walking away "in search of more travelers".

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Just a note, I did a quick goggle search and it tells me that the Great Pyramid is visible from 20-30 miles away (around 5 hexes).

 

[Zardnaar]

How tall is what'shisfaces?

 

[Paul Farquhar]

How tall is what'shisfaces?

It doesn't say, (apart from calling it "Great") but to fit the contents it must be at least as big as our Great Pyramid (remember width determines height, and much of the structure is solid stone), which would be 480 ft.

Addendum. I've just noticed that the Blackpool Tower (which I know well) is about 40 ft. taller. That's visible from around 30 miles away (Southport).

 

[Zardnaar]

It doesn't say, (apart from calling it "Great") but to fit the contents it must be at least as big as our Great Pyramid (remember width determines height), which would be 480 ft.

Great pyramid is 756 cheeseburger units.

 

[pukunui]

It doesn't say, (apart from calling it "Great") but to fit the contents it must be at least as big as our Great Pyramid (remember width determines height, and much of the structure is solid stone), which would be 480 ft.

The 5e version doesn't specify, but the original version does:

In the midst of the vast desert sands, the last relic of a dead civilization stands before you. Surrounded by the broken foundations of a once mighty city, the great pyramid itself rises up from the sands, looking barely touched by time. It is 745 feet square at the base and rises to a height of 700 feet.

So it's taller than the real pyramid upon which it is based. However, I don't think it's meant to be in the middle of a flat plain. There are hills, sand dunes, and the like that could block the view of it from the desert floor, although it would likely be visible from the peaks.