To be or Not to be (undead), that is the question.

[Lady Sabelle]

If given the choice to take the undead template, would you? This very question has recently been put to myself and the other members of our party. My uneducated, gut reaction would be an immediate "NO" but then when I think of generic undead I think, Zombie. Not the least bit appealing. So I put it to you, to discuss the pro's and con's of life (or unlife as the case may be) as undead.

I am also seeking advice as to what we might do to maximize our potential as undead and if there are any magic items or spells that might help protect and preserve us. (I do NOT want to end up as a rotting corpse!)

But I suppose I should add a few details as to the circumstances of our situation. We have a home-brew item that when used the subject simply gains the undead template and is not automatically subject to the control of the person using the item. In our party we have a Dread Necromancer who will be "creating" us and he's taken the Corpsecrafter and Bolster Resistance feats from the Libris Mortis. (Giving us +4 str, +2 hp/ HD and +4 turn resistance) We are currently 7th level with access to 20th level casters.

As this is my first Thread I hope to hear lots of great ideas from all of you. Thank you in advance.

 

[Nifft]

No. It's often a hindrance to detect as Evil, and too many templates either look icky or melt in sunlight.

Cheers, -- N

 

[werk]

No, unless you are playing an evil character the thought of being undead should repulse you.

The only benefits are all game mechnics that really shouldn't appeal to the character unless the character has returned from the dead a hundred times and really doesn't care about anything anymore, life or death.

If you are playing evil, sure, why not?

 

[TYPO5478]

I feel like I should first point out that "Undead" is a type, not a template. If all this item does is change your type to Undead, you may want to think again. On the other hand, if you get any particular one of the variety of undead templates (like lich, mummy, vampire, etc.) then it may possibly be worth it. That's something to double check with your DM: do you get to choose an undead template (of which there are many), or do you just gain the undead type and everything that goes along with it?

Assuming to begin with that I didn't mind becoming undead at all, I definitely wouldn't want to be a zombie or skeleton. Vampires can be good for physical characters, especially monks. Obviously, casters will want to head for the Lich template.

There may be other templates that would be appealing (again, as appealing as being undead can be) in other books. I know Complete Arcane has the Spellstitched template (although I think that has to be applied along with some other undead template). I think there's something in Complete Divine, but I don't remember off the top of my head. Also check various iterations of Monster Manuals and such. I'm not familiar with Libris Mortis, but it seems like it'd be a good place to look.

Ultimately, I think it comes down to character choice. I actually had to make this choice in my current campaign. My character was too "attached" to life to let it go to become a lich. But, as they like to say around here, YMMV.

 

[Darklone]

Undead spellcasters? LA? NONONONONONO!

Stylewise: I only played one char in about 25 years now that would have considered to become undead "from a purely scientific point of view, so to say".

 

[Gestalt]

The closest thing I know to a basic Undead template is the Necropolitan from Libris Mortis, which basically gives you the undead type and a bit of resistance to usual undead control methods. I have played two of them briefly.

Mechanically the Undead type is more advantageous to some characters than others. You get a d12 HD but no Constitution bonus, so ideally you would be a character with a weak HD type and no Constitution bonus before the change. It's pretty good for wizardly types, and a Necropolitan does it by spending experience but avoiding a caster-killing LA. Everyone can benefit from the undead immunities.

The downside is that people don't like undead. Undead are so unpopular that clerics have special abilities to completely destroy them. Spells like Invisibility to Undead and Disrupting Weapon will spoil your day. The social effects may be campaign dependent, but I have always found them inconvenient at best.

If the Corpsecrafter feats are working on PC undead it becomes a lot nicer. That turn resistance boost will at least block a cleric's ability to casually eliminate you.

Things you may want to pick up:
-Hats of Disguise to hide your terrible undead nature
-A good Bluff check, to convince that Paladin you are actually affected by an evil spell, and certainly aren't the crypt fiend everyone is looking for.
-A Cloak of Turn Resistance (Libris Mortis). This does take up the Cloak slot but pretty much makes your Turning worries disappear.

 

[lukelightning]

I'd be rather suspicous of anyone offering to turn me into an undead being. Necromancers are famous for creating undead slaves, not undead drinking buddies.

 

[Nifft]

Necromancers are famous for creating undead slaves, not undead drinking buddies.

Vampires, on the other hand...

Cheers, -- N

 

[Darklone]

Vampires, on the other hand...

Cheers, -- N

... are famous for creating buddies to drink.

 

[Lady Sabelle]

Well, does it matter that we all have non-detection items when considering to become undead? One of the first items I would research is a Hat of Disguise Undead. I got the impression that a hat of disguise wouldn't work on undead or at least not as well.

And as for alignment... we're all on the darker side of Neutral. Not evil exactly but definitely not good. With a healthy side of self-importance. The DM says that our alignment wouldn't change. Something to do with the artifact that does it. We also won't have a LA. Again something to do with the home-brew item.

I got the impression from the DM that we would be exactly the same as we are now but with the d12 HD, no Con score, immunity to crits, the usual undead traits. So I guess that means we will only get the undead type.

The downside is that people don't like undead. Undead are so unpopular that clerics have special abilities to completely destroy them. Spells like Invisibility to Undead and Disrupting Weapon will spoil your day. The social effects may be campaign dependent, but I have always found them inconvenient at best.

This brings up a good question. Would a see invisible spell work for undead against an invisibility to undead spell?

The social effects are minimal as the world uses mindless undead as a cheap workforce and they have Vampiric Shopkeepers. As long as you don't break the law, they don't care what you are. And if a Cleric makes an unprovoked attack just because you're undead the law is on your side.

And lastly, the Necromancer in question is a fellow party member who has every reason to work with us not against. He is the same level as we are so he can't command us and finally the item does not give him control of us. Besides, he's working his way to being undead again himself. (having lost 17 levels through magical means and in the process losing his undead status. Please don't ask me to explain... it's too complicated... and somewhat unbelievable) He also has an item that gives an extra boost to turn resistance while we are near it. +4 I believe.