To Many Publishers?

Vigilance said:
Well Darrin, obviously no one reads sigs, and sarcasm is like dead people, you can either see it or it you can't :)

I totally saw and appreciated the sarcasm. :D My little bit of insight was more a response to the original post.
 

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Cool- just making sure I didn't come off as bashing WoTC mostly (given how much Modern stuff I do it would be hard for me to try and paint them as the evil empire lol).

Im grumpy tonight anyway *stupid Arthurian statblocks*.

Cough.

Nothing to see here move along.

Chuck
 

RPGObjects - gawd, I knew I was leaving one of my favorites off the list. I think I need to be dogpiled for omitting you guys. Darwin's world is easily one of my favorite product lines. In fact, I would go ahead and say that in my opinion its one of the best things to come out of the OGL and D20 license. I've seen it grow from a fairly short PDF with eh... interesting formatting to one of the most interesting, compelling, and well produced product lines on the market. I also very much like Blood and Space. I have yet to check out the new Arthurian game, but I haven't ruled it out.
 

*stomps his foot* Scarred Lands stuff isn't crap! Sure in the beginning it was tough going but now we've righted the ship! CC Revised is blowing CC1 out of the water, and come Edge of Infinity, every one will see why we have a great cosmology too! ;)
 

Well, crap is clearly in the eye of the beholder. I've stated before that I'm one of the 16, no, make it 17 fans of the Spelljammer setting.
One more :) My DM's a fan.

Myself I'm one fo the few fans of the Mystara setting. But there was a lot of @#%&-material put out for it.
 

As a reviewer who still buys products, I can say that there is too much stuff out there.

A lot of it is good but is being lost in the shuffle.

Too much material on the same ground. For example, Mongoose had Seas of Blood and Slayer's Guide to Dragons, but now have, or soon will have, $34.95 hardcovers to replace those books. This doesn't count third party material like Mystic Eye Games The Deep, an underwater sourcebook I'm still knee deep in reading.

Lots of good stuff out there and you're fortuante to have Games Plus (if it's the one in Mt. Prospect) as your guide as you can get a lot of material there that's not even available in some stores anymore.
 

Corinth said:
I don't think so.

This conversation is ongoing on listservs such as those hosted by the Open Gaming Foundation, as well as private correspondance (that I'm not privy to, but hear of by those participating--i.e. "I've talked to (X) privately about this."), but it's not the only issue that must be addressed. Why are there not more companies publishing under the Sword & Sorcery Studios banner? Why not negotiate an accord that creates a new and viable channel of publishing module support materials for third-party settings? Why not work together to develop and publize alternative distribution channels to the current outlets? Why not create a hobby-wide organization--one that subsumes existing, but too-specialized groups like GAMA, the GPA and the OGF--that possessed the resources and size required to do the things that individual publishers want to do but can't because they're too small- such as following WotC and WWGS into leveraging their IP into other media, such as comics and videogames.

I'm throwing out ideas here. The point is that if the publishers were to act on the principle of working for the advantage of the other--to create a business community where publishers, retailers and distributors actively and earnestly cooperate on all things--then the long-desired goal of mainstreaming the hobby (something that's already happening with videogames) not only becomes possible, but inevitable. That is entirely a good thing for all concerned; gamers have more people to play with, publishers have more buyers and thus more resources to make more games, retailers can grow their stores into the ideal forms desired by all and distributors will be able to grow their networks into forms that fully realize their desire to connect all sellers to all buyers.

We had this once in the United States. We called it "The New Deal".

Which is the seed that shall bring about their downfall. This is a short-sighted view that generates actions that damage the community and the marketplace that serves it, which in turn fractures the community and turns it against itself. The tragedy of TSR shall repeat itself again if this continues, and the hobby will decline into utter obscurity (leading to extinction within a generation) as the result of such a wicked paradigm. Thinking in terms of how to best serve the whole of the community, and to do so over the long-term, is the way that--in all things--is certain to produce the desired longevity and relevance that many in and out of the business of the hobby desire (and rightly so). This is the idea behind such things as the Open Gaming Movement.

That one cannot sense a thing does not mean that it isn't there. This short-sighted "all-against-all" thinking is what nearly destroyed the hobby twice, once in the early 1980s and against when TSR fell in the late 1990s. A third such event shall end it all for everyone. We--regardless of position--cannot allow that to happen, not if we are truly a just people.

Oh I agree with you on principle. I'd love to see something like what you're suggesting, but I've also seen/read the head honchos at different d20 companies snipping at each other (sometimes with good reason) that would prevent such cooperation.

I think the one company that *could* do what you're suggesting might be Wizards of the Coast by altering the d20 license. However, the beauty (for WotC) about d20 is it sells more Player's Handbooks, and while they may tweak the license here and there, they probably don't want to spend their time in oversight any more than they have to.

Also, I should add that I misspoke in my earlier post. Not *all* d20 companies are out to make only what sells best, but many of them are. (Necromancer Games comes to mind as one that makes what they *want* to make, not what will necessarily sell best.)
 
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johnsemlak said:
One more :) My DM's a fan.

Make me the 19th Spelljammer fan. You can take my Giff First Mate from my Cold, Dead Fingers, Andy Collins! ;)

I see a glut of product, myself, but only because of the natural urges of creativity and capitalism, as it should be. Many people have the chance to do something they never before had solid legal ground to do, and whether they make it or not, they have tried, and in the case of PDF only publishers, have lost little to no money doing so.

I don't complain that there are 15 brands of toilet paper at my local supermarket. I pick one and go with it. People don't complain about the glut of magazines at the newstand, that I know of: I guar-an-tee there are FAR more magazine offerings than d20 publications at the newstand! I only buy three or four magazines out of the thousands available, and leave the rest alone - they don't interest me. And there's nothing wrong with that.
 


Corinth said:
The point is that if the publishers were to act on the principle of working for the advantage of the other--to create a business community where publishers, retailers and distributors actively and earnestly cooperate on all things--then the long-desired goal of mainstreaming the hobby (something that's already happening with videogames) not only becomes possible, but inevitable.

...

We had this once in the United States. We called it "The New Deal".


New Deal was a government project, instituted by the government, enshrined in LAW and ultimately enforced by the instruments of violence available to the national government. It went so far as to precipitate a Constitutional crisis wherein the president attempted to rewrite the makeup of the Supreme Court. However, Roosevelt's court-packing bill failed. Illusions of "cooperation" are a matter of rose-colored spectacles immersed in highly selective memory. The policies were fought tooth and nail and were very difficult to implement--ultimately, Roosevelt had to point out that swallowing hard and accepting a little socialism was better than a Bolshevik revolution in the USA.

You are of the opinion that this situation requires federal government intervention of that massive a scope? You are of the opinion that the current situation is so grave that the entirety of the USA is on the verge of violent revolution that would end up in Soviet-style government? I think not.
 

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