Level Up (A5E) Today I am working on Exploration Challenges

[dave2008]

Only if it says so! I think you're reading into these more than what's on the actual page.

Hmm. I guess I am interested in the design intent. The formatting, which is what you wanted feedback on, leads me to believe a success or critical success has no affect on the Acidic Spray and Dissolving Provisions properties (as they are not mentioned in the Success or Critical Success). Is that what you intended? If so, the format is good, IMO; if not, then you might have an issue with the format.

Incorrect. The way to avoid that is the next sentence.

Yes, I should have clarified: "Without bypassing the challenge."

 

[Stalker0]

We don’t use number of successes. We make a lot of use of the group check mechanic though (more than half the party needs to succeed).

I like that mechanic as well. It can have flavor issues with other types of “skill challenges”, but with exploration it makes total sense. A ranger by himself will succeed very often, a ranger with a buddy....the ranger helps his buddy most of the time. Ranger with several city slickers, ranger does what he can but the others have to pull some wait or they will suffer.

 

[tetrasodium]

I like that mechanic as well. It can have flavor issues with other types of “skill challenges”, but with exploration it makes total sense. A ranger by himself will succeed very often, a ranger with a buddy....the ranger helps his buddy most of the time. Ranger with several city slickers, ranger does what he can but the others have to pull some wait or they will suffer.

I think that they both have a place in a GMs arsenal of tools used to un a fun session. Not every EC will be fun for every group of every level & situation. The same applies to monsters the gm just handwaves away with a vague "and you slaughter them" type statement or has run away leaving everyone thrilled to go back to not needing to sit through the slog with zero chance of mattering. Take the acid field, using it early or even opening with it & spending a bit interacting with it for a bit can set the stage & deeply root the tone for the rest of the session in a lot of ways . Quickly wrapping up with it can nicely fill the extra few minutes at the end of the intended session & setup the next session for a clean start. Maybe the players did something totally unexpected & now the gm is making them weave through a drawn out EC while the hamster wheel & hamster is screaming in panic trying to figure out how to reshape their plans before the players get to watch the holodeck glitching out & building the world in a slow motion trainwreck around them

 

[FitzTheRuke]

Success over the challenge. There's a table there which says "Critical Failure, Failure, Success, Critical Success." It's the third one in that list. You can succeed at the challenge by moving at slow pace (at the cost of time and Supply, of course). If you're in a hurry, that's obviously not an option available to you.

View attachment 135015

I think if Success is the intent of that last sentence, than it should say "grants you Success" or "you achieve Success" or some version of that. I also wondered how many successes you needed when I read that because it says "counts" (suggesting you might count them) and "a" Success (suggesting that there could be more than one.)

I don't think that my reading trouble had anything to do with 4e skill challenges, but it might have done.

I do admit that while I like these a lot (and I really, really like them in concept)... I find that (at the moment) they confuse me in how to run them. I expect that will work itself out when I have the full intro and some practice with it.

I worry that a DM would run this by just reading the scenario and asking for a group check, and then giving the result of the check, which would be terrible (IMO). I can see freeform, as you intend, being good when done well, though.

 

[Faolyn]

I worry that a DM would run this by just reading the scenario and asking for a group check, and then giving the result of the check, which would be terrible (IMO). I can see freeform, as you intend, being good when done well, though.

I assume that you mean the DM calls for the check, the players succeed or not, and the DM says "OK, you've made it past the challenge," and that's it, instead of at least narrating the events within.

There's a large part of me that worries asking for a single group Survival check isn't enough. However, there are other rolls involved, so I'm not sure how many Survival checks would make the whole thing feel right. Part of me wants to call for one check each hour--which is still only one check in the case of the Acid Fields and Corrupted Grove. (I will say it's odd that a place that only requires an hour to traverse would add an additional 1d4+1 days to travel around.) Bolding for emphasis, and for requesting an explanation.

Lemme try out the Acid Fields here and see how it looks. I'll assume I'm running for my current party of five PCs, who are about 6th level (so, half the party, meaning 3 PCs have to succeed because I'm going to round up). So, three succeeded (I rolled!), so they pass. No particular hazards.

I describe them as seeing acid geysers go off, occasionally almost stepping in sizzling puddles, and seeing the corroded bones of creatures that weren't as lucky. Let them explore if they feel like it. Hmm... I can see the rogue, who's day job is herbalist, wanting to see if there are any particularly hardy acid-plants around for her to harvest. I'm going to assume that this would be covered using the "gathering supplies" rules, which I think you said are going to exist. Doing this would increase the time spent here, which would increase the chances of getting caught in the acidic spray.

Halfway through, I have them roll a Dex save--I assume it's still 15--or get caught in an acid geyser. Do I have them roll twice, once at the half-hour mark and once at the hour mark, even though after the hour they are leaving the field (assuming they didn't stay to look for stuff or fight a monster)?

Also, now I'm slightly confused and/or annoyed. The fact that they are walking at a slow pace should maybe give them advantage on their save against the geyser, but letting them avoid it completely? That kind of takes away from the fun of having an acid field in the first place! And it kind of assumes that they're traveling from A to B for a distinct purpose and have a time crunch, where walking at normal speed would be preferable. If they're just traveling, as many parties are wont to do, then they don't lose anything by traveling slowly and they gain auto-success.

 

[Stalker0]

(I will say it's odd that a place that only requires an hour to traverse would add an additional 1d4+1 days to travel around.)

If the area around it is very treacherous and mountainous, or deep jungle as another example, I could possibly see it. As Morrus noted in the OP, the encounters assume the DM has put a reason for the party to move through such terrain, like being bottlenecked by mountains as an example.

 

[Morrus]

(I will say it's odd that a place that only requires an hour to traverse would add an additional 1d4+1 days to travel around.) Bolding for emphasis, and for requesting an explanation.

Simple. If you can just walk around it, it's not an exploration challenge, it's just a curious bit of scenery.

You might see many of those on your journeys. But the only ones which become exploration challenges are the ones which block your path. They block the mountain pass, or the safe path through the swamp, or the forest trail, or the only river crossing, and if you choose not to engage with the exploration challenge you have to backtrack and choose a different route.

So yes, there's lots of lava pits and corrupted druid groves and quicksand patches which you can just walk around. They aren't exploration challenges because there's no challenge. The ones which block your way are exploration challenges.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

Simple. If you can just walk around it, it's not an exploration challenge, it's just a curious bit of scenery.

You might see many of those on your journeys. But the only ones which become exploration challenges are the ones which block your path. They block the mountain pass, or the safe path through the swamp, or the forest trail, or the only river crossing, and if you choose not to engage with the exploration challenge you have to backtrack and choose a different route.

So yes, there's lots of lava pits and corrupted druid groves and quicksand patches which you can just walk around. They aren't exploration challenges because there's no challenge. The ones which block your way are exploration challenges.

If you are going to discourage them from chosing to go around (which I agree with) then why make them "win" just by going slowly THROUGH it?

 

[Morrus]

If you are going to discourage them from chosing to go around (which I agree with) then why make them "win" just by going slowly THROUGH it?

I dunno man. I was just asking about general formatting and included info on a draft example really. I’m not on the mechanics or the balancing. I’ll leave that to the experts. Sorry!

 

[Faolyn]

Deleted