Training

[Crothian]

I'm going to post my training rules here. I'm trying to come up with something fair for the PCs. Because it costs money and time to train I want to reward the PCs. That is why there is a chance of learning something extra. Now, I know it's a bad idea to base extra abilities off a random percentile. However, I don't want to give something extra every level and I need a way of determining when something extra is learned with it being predetermined (like every third level). So, would making it a wisdom roll or something stat related be better? Also, the table that determines what extra is learned is also random and only one table. Should it be different for the different classes to reflect their training habits? Are some of the things to much? Are some too weak? Any and all help is appreciated.

Training

Once a character has achieved enough experience to advance in level he must find a person of higher level then himself to train with. The trainer need not be of higher character level, just higher in whatever class is gaining a level in. The training takes time and money. The amount may wary from trainer to trainer with the following values being given as averages.

Normal Class Level Cost in Gold Pieces
1-4 10xlevel
5-8 50xlevel
9-12 100xlevel
13-16 500xlevel
17-20 1,000xlevel

Prestige Class Level Cost in Gold Pieces
1-3 50xlevel
4-6 250xlevel
7-9 500xlevel
10 2,500xlevel

Time: Normal classes take 12 hours of training per level. Prestige Classes take 16 hours per level.
A normal person can train up to eight hours a day with no problems. One may attempt to train longer. For each hour of additional training the character must make a constitution check. The endurance feat helps with this. The DC is 12+1 per additional hour of training. If the attempt fails then the training is done for the day. If the attempt fails by more then five then the character must rest a full day due to mental and physical exhaustion. If the attempt fails by 15 or more then the character must rest an entire week or only one day if magical healing is available.

Once the training is complete the player may roll a percentile die to see if the training was exceptional (typically 20%). If something extra is learned roll upon the following table to determine what it is.

01-20 +1 Skill Point
21-30 +2 Skill Points
31-36 +1d6 Skill Points
37-56 +2 Skill Points (Must be spent on Class Skills)
57-59 +1d6 Skill Points (Must be spent on Class Skills)
60-61 +1d8 Skill Points (Must be spent on Class Skills)
62-69 Skill Focus (Must be on a Class Skill)
70 Double Skill Points learned
71-77 Weapon Focus Feat
78-85 Toughness Feat
86-89 Luck of Heroes Feat (if already has it, then reroll)
90 Choose one feat
91-92 +1d4x100xp
93-94 +1d6x100xp
95-96 +1d8x100xp
97-98 +1d10x100xp
99 +1d12x100xp
00 +1 to any ability score

Self-Training: There may come a time in any adventures life that he will be unable to find someone to train him. When this happens, simply double the time of the training. The chance of gaining additional ability is 5%.

 

[Schmoe]

I'm going to post my training rules here. I'm trying to come up with something fair for the PCs. Because it costs money and time to train I want to reward the PCs. That is why there is a chance of learning something extra. Now, I know it's a bad idea to base extra abilities off a random percentile. However, I don't want to give something extra every level and I need a way of determining when something extra is learned with it being predetermined (like every third level). So, would making it a wisdom roll or something stat related be better?

Personally, I think the effects of training should be more dependent on the amount of time and money a character sinks into it, as well as the quality of the instructor. It might work well to have a base cost and time for training, and every increment above the base that is spent on training can increase the amount of X gained.

Also, the table that determines what extra is learned is also random and only one table. Should it be different for the different classes to reflect their training habits? Are some of the things to much? Are some too weak? Any and all help is appreciated.

Training

Once a character has achieved enough experience to advance in level he must find a person of higher level then himself to train with. The trainer need not be of higher character level, just higher in whatever class is gaining a level in. The training takes time and money. The amount may wary from trainer to trainer with the following values being given as averages.

Normal Class Level Cost in Gold Pieces
1-4 10xlevel
5-8 50xlevel
9-12 100xlevel
13-16 500xlevel
17-20 1,000xlevel

Prestige Class Level Cost in Gold Pieces
1-3 50xlevel
4-6 250xlevel
7-9 500xlevel
10 2,500xlevel

Time: Normal classes take 12 hours of training per level. Prestige Classes take 16 hours per level.
A normal person can train up to eight hours a day with no problems. One may attempt to train longer. For each hour of additional training the character must make a constitution check. The endurance feat helps with this. The DC is 12+1 per additional hour of training. If the attempt fails then the training is done for the day. If the attempt fails by more then five then the character must rest a full day due to mental and physical exhaustion. If the attempt fails by 15 or more then the character must rest an entire week or only one day if magical healing is available.

Once the training is complete the player may roll a percentile die to see if the training was exceptional (typically 20%). If something extra is learned roll upon the following table to determine what it is.

01-20 +1 Skill Point
21-30 +2 Skill Points
31-36 +1d6 Skill Points
37-56 +2 Skill Points (Must be spent on Class Skills)
57-59 +1d6 Skill Points (Must be spent on Class Skills)
60-61 +1d8 Skill Points (Must be spent on Class Skills)
62-69 Skill Focus (Must be on a Class Skill)
70 Double Skill Points learned
71-77 Weapon Focus Feat
78-85 Toughness Feat
86-89 Luck of Heroes Feat (if already has it, then reroll)
90 Choose one feat
91-92 +1d4x100xp
93-94 +1d6x100xp
95-96 +1d8x100xp
97-98 +1d10x100xp
99 +1d12x100xp
00 +1 to any ability score

Self-Training: There may come a time in any adventures life that he will be unable to find someone to train him. When this happens, simply double the time of the training. The chance of gaining additional ability is 5%.

I think the benefits you have listed are a little too generous. Actually, I'm not really sure why any extra benefit is necessary at all. You could just say that, until a character performs the necessary training, he doesn't get any new class abilities except for Hit Dice, Base Attack Bonus, and Saves. Ie, skills, feats, special class abilities, spells, etc., all require training to access. In addition, the character can't advance to the amount of experience needed to gain the next level until he has completed the training for the current level.

However, that's probably not what you're interested in.

If you are set on providing some sort of benefit for training, I would suggest that you really tone down the benefits available, in addition to decreasing the randomness. The reason would be for balance. Someone who has gone for 8 levels without getting any benefit couldn't help but feel overshadowed by the person who has received, for his last three levels: 1200 xp, a bonus feat, and a +1 to a stat of his/her choice! When you compare the extremes, you can see how the system might affect your game.

I have a few recommendations. First, make it so that the chance of a character receiving benefit for training is more within the players' control. Either say that a character always gets a benefit, or allow players to increase their odds through certain actions (perhaps by the aforementioned additional expenditures of time or money).

Second, keep the benefits small, and allow the player to choose what type of benefit he wants for his character. I'm not sure that you need a broad range of benefits; it could be as simple as gaining either 1-2 extra skill points or the choice of one of a small selection of feats. If you want to retain a random aspect to the benefit, allow the player to choose a category of benefit, and then roll randomly within that category.

Hmm, I guess that's about all I can think of right now. Hope this helps.

 

[Crothian]

Ya, it's helpful. Telling me things I already know, but need to hear anyway.

The reason I want the chance of something extra learned is to reward PCs for spending money and time on training. Training rules are extra. By using them I complicate the PCs lives. So, there should be something that makes the PCs feel this is worth it.

The table does need to be toned down a lot. I'm also thinking of making more that reflects areas of studies. Different Tables might be: Offensive, Defensive, Arcane, Divine, Skills, or something like that. Suggestions are welcomed.

Also, I'd like a way to make the chance more controled by the PCs. Is having it cost more enough? Another wierd thought I had was using their best attribute as a DC 20 check. I'd like it to be one attribute, but then that would favor one class. Or perhaps I can make a table for each attribute and you roll for each attribute. However, you can only get one thing so you pick which you want to try for first. I'll have to think on that....

 

[Infinite Monkey]

How about this...

When you train, make a Wis check DC 30 (or maybe even higher).
If you succeed, you get 10 x New level free experience points per point you beat the check by (or some other minor benefit).

For every level your trainer is higher than you, add a +1 bonus to the check. For every day you train beyond the neccessary add +1 to the check. Extra training days cost the base cost each (e.g. 10gp at level 1-4. 1000gp at 17-20).

That way, if you have a particularily experienced teacher or spend a lot more time (and so money) training, you get more experience.

I think that bonus experience is most appropriate, because it simulates the training making the character better at what they do.

Having a very high DC means that characters that only put the minimum effort in get no bonuses.


You could also simplify it further, and make it even less random, by saying ...

When training, once you complete your training, you get :
10 x X x Y x New Level free experience points
where X is the number of levels higher than you the trainer is and Y is the number of EXTRA days you spend training.

This way it is possible to gain level just by training long and hard with a good instructor, which seems quite realistic to me.