Transhuman Space: Beyond Good and Evil

Jürgen Hubert

First Post
"The time would be easy to know, for then mankind would have become as the Great Old Ones; free and wild and beyond good and evil, with laws and morals thrown aside..."

- H. P. Lovecraft


Transhuman Space has sometimes been described as "optimistic" or even "utopian". Certainly, the vast majority of humans are far better off than they are now. They live longer, are healthier, have access to more conveniences, and technology empowers them like never before to let them do what they want.

Look at that last sentence again.

"Technology empowers them to let them do what they want."

Does that worry you even a bit?

Fifth Wave technology gives people unparalleled freedom to shape their own lives. But does it also make them more responsible?

Or does it only let them shed their last few inhibitions?

Mind-altering substances are so commonly available that it becomes hard to figure out who someone - even yourself really is. Is your sense of self as variable as the chemicals you imbibe? Thanks to advances in cybershell and virtual reality technology, almost any sexual perversion can be played out and be perfectly legal in many places. Scenarios involving rape, pedophia, bestiality and worse things can easily be acted out with the right technology. Will there be anyone left to object to such things when no human is actually harmed? Radical bodily alterations are becoming more and more common - even turning into a creature of pure data is possible. Humanity seems eager to create more and more variants of sapient creatures to share the world with. But who can say in such a world what is "human" and what isn't? Each generation becomes stranger than the preceding one - but now the older generations don't die off but shuffle on as their whole world increasingly turns into something uncomprehensibly alien.

Humanity becomes less and less willing to accept any restraints. Perhaps this will be the coming Singularity of which Vernor Vinge spoke - the day when humanity at last breaks down all barriers it has placed on itself and truly does become "free and wild and beyond good and evil".


Welcome to the world of Transhuman Space. If you aren't worried, you just haven't thought it through.







Sorry, but I somehow felt compelled to write that. Make of this what you will...
 

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Jurgen - you're making it harder and harder to resist the siren call of GURPS... does Changing Times contain all the info needed to run a Transhuman Space game?
 

Timmundo said:
Jurgen - you're making it harder and harder to resist the siren call of GURPS... does Changing Times contain all the info needed to run a Transhuman Space game?

No. It is partially an update for Transhuman Space to play it with GURPS 4E (while the rest of the books were written for GURPS 3E), and partially GM advice - useful, but not neccessary.

To play Transhuman Space, you need the main Transhuman Space books - other GURPS books are not needed, since it includes a variant of GURPS Lite, a 32-page summarey of the GURPS (3E) rules.
 

Jürgen Hubert said:
Look at that last sentence again.
"Technology empowers them to let them do what they want."
Does that worry you even a bit?

Nope, not in the least. It just makes me hope I live long enough to see it.

Jürgen Hubert said:
Welcome to the world of Transhuman Space. If you aren't worried, you just haven't thought it through.

I've thought it through quite a lot and I utterly refute that last sentence.
 

WayneLigon said:
Nope, not in the least. It just makes me hope I live long enough to see it.



I've thought it through quite a lot and I utterly refute that last sentence.

Well, truth to be told, I would also look forward to a Transhuman Space future - it seems to be far better than most of the alternatives. And I was exaggerating a bit for effect.

But not for much. The cultural and social environment in the TS era is likely to be at least somewhat disturbing for modern-day people. And for many, it is likely to be very disturbing. Memetic science has assaulted the sense of self, with emotions and beliefs seen as something interchangeable. Many nations - including the USA - practice slavery of sapient beings. There are a large number of thinking beings which have created for no other reason than to have sex with them.

Would nothing of these worry you at least a bit?
 

I have read through TS a couple of times now and find it absolutely fascinating ... and absolutely terrifying. Yes, the mass of humanity is materially better off, with cures for many common diseases, etc., but the wealth and power controlled by a small core of nigh-immortal individuals is unnerving, to say the least. The dividing line between human and not-human is razor thin. And, ultimately, the world feels very crowded, mechanistic, and sterile -- we do well on a collective-material level, but I am not convinced that emotionally or psychologically/spiritually people are doing that well.

The setting feels very "cold" to me. It is not the whole cyberpunk run-around-and-bring-down-the-man level, but in many ways I feel this is not a time or place that would develop a Shakespeare or a Picasso. I find it quite dark and disheartening, a world where people are even more tied to simplistic, material answers for happiness than are found right now, with even fewer questions being asked about the underlying structure of society and humanity.

Like I said, the book really makes me think. ;)

I suppose that utopia/dystopia is in the eye of the beholder. :D

(Like many books of its ilk, I love TS, but am not fond of GURPS; I own something like 15 supplements, but sold the core books years ago.)
 

Jürgen Hubert said:
Would nothing of these worry you at least a bit?

Nope. I see a lot of the imagined excesses as self-selecting the people who would engage in them out of the system after a time. Further on down the line, I see the sapient machines used in this matter re-writing the glandular and hormone levels of the 24-sex-person so they're cured.
 

Jürgen Hubert said:
"The time would be easy to know, for then mankind would have become as the Great Old Ones; free and wild and beyond good and evil, with laws and morals thrown aside..."

- H. P. Lovecraft


Transhuman Space has sometimes been described as "optimistic" or even "utopian". Certainly, the vast majority of humans are far better off than they are now. They live longer, are healthier, have access to more conveniences, and technology empowers them like never before to let them do what they want.

Look at that last sentence again.

"Technology empowers them to let them do what they want."

Does that worry you even a bit?


nope
 

Jürgen Hubert said:
Thanks to advances in cybershell and virtual reality technology, almost any sexual perversion can be played out and be perfectly legal in many places. Scenarios involving rape, pedophia, bestiality and worse things can easily be acted out with the right technology.
Hell, have you ever played Second Life (if one can be said to "play" something that's not so much a game as a graphical chat application)? Those days are already here, and they are exactly as ugly as you predict.

But, even if simulated furry, Gorean, and ageplay communities are the inevitable result, I still can't see a problem with a transhuman future according to the way you're describing it.

Now, certainly, if the technology and resources to make humanity into gods at play isn't shared equally among the species (and, let's admit it, that sounds pretty likely) then the whims of the transhuman will likely be a terrible thing for the merely mortal population. People "empowered to do what they want" are a very bad thing when not everybody is so empowered.

But if we're going to go with the assumption of a true post-scarcity society, where we've all got the power to do what we want, and thus can exist free of others' power, then "optimistic" and "utopian" barely come close to describing such a future.

Why should anyone object to simulated depravities where no sentient creature is harmed? What does it matter if the definition of "human" rapidly becomes meaningless? Why should the older immortals care that society becomes ever stranger around them, when there are plenty of their own generation around to preserve their own societies?

The way I see it, a transhuman, post-scarcity society would resemble the Internet mapped onto the physical world: Full of unbelievably horrible, retarded stuff that you have no use for, but you have no real obligation to ever experience those things. Find the things and the people that you're into, join or establish communities that work for you, create or share things that you like, and you'll have all the entertainment, pleasure, intellectual stimulation, and good company that you could want.

The only grounds one could object on are drastically illogical "I don't like the kind of fun those people are having!" arguments.

EDIT:
Jürgen Hubert said:
Many nations - including the USA - practice slavery of sapient beings. There are a large number of thinking beings which have created for no other reason than to have sex with them.
Ah, well that is a different story. I didn't realize that the setting included intelligent slaves and playthings. Yeah, natural or artificial, physical or digital, it ain't okay to keep slaves. I had assumed that all sapients were included under that "empowered to do what they want" heading.
 
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Jürgen Hubert said:
There are a large number of thinking beings which have created for no other reason than to have sex with them.

Cue Selfish Gene anthropic principle.

Also, I can think of a lot worse reasons to live... :)

Cheers, -- N
 

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