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This friday my group is going to encounter the 'evil party' in the Temple of the Echoed Souls.... The module talks about the possibility of talking a couple of the evil party to switch sides, or possibly even split the group into two factions, making it easier to defeat them.
Since I am a fan of mechanics supporting this sort of thing instead of having a 'cause the DM thought it was right' approach, below is my initial stab at how to work this.
Note, I use Stalker0's Obsideon skill challenge system.
[sblock]
The Evil Party presents some non-combat options for defeating:
In combat skill challenges checks are a move action, so technically you can go for an action point and talk this combat into something else entirely. In both cases, this is more than only a skill check… the player has to provide a reasonable argument tailored to the NPC they are addressing.
Turning Katrina or Shalosha
Both these ladies are not sure of the rightness their place and can be convinced to switch sides (turning into companions for the remainder of the encounter). Mechanically, a diplomacy skill challenge with a DC of 36 goes as follows:
1 Success; target is marked by you and unable to attack you
2 Successes; Loss of conviction, Target weakened
3 Successes; Target becomes a companion
Katrina as companion will be lethally focused on slaying those she double-crossed as she knows her fate if they life to tell of her betrayal. (LE)
Shalosha as companion will prefer options of capturing or letting escape those she was with (LG).
Inquisitor Etienne can counter the successes with a Diplomacy or Bluff check of her own, vs DC 31 {needs an 11 or better}
Sowing seeds of discontent
- The key is the ‘Warriors of the Fourth Army’ vision, which shows Ursus battling Shahalestian warriors, and the presence of the monk acolyte. This foreshadows Pilus’ involvement in the in the upcoming battle, but also can be used as a wedge between the Shahalesti warriors {Nahrem, Rhiallis, Shalosha} and the Ragesian {Karedan, Ursus, and Etienne}.. possibly getting them to fight amongst themselves. Either approach of recalling the loss of the Shahalesti fleet ships at the hand of Pilus, or the blunt approach of Ursus battling their own.
Mechanically, this would be a Social skill challenge with Diplomacy as the primary skill. Again, the DC is 36 {Hard +5 due to being in combat}
2 success: No effect
3 successes: the two sides start treating each other as enemies for targeting purposes, but no active attacking… just accidental wounding. The DC reduces to 33.
4 successes: Split achieved! Shalosha becomes a companion, the others will choose based on location and recent activity on who to attack {the PCs could retreat at this point, or obviously side with one faction… but are still ‘enemies’ mechanically}
Again, Etienne can counter the successes with a DC 31 check of her own, {11 or better}
Katrina will side with the Ragesians, although she could still be turned.
[/sblock]
I appreciate any assistance on this.
I would post the badguys here if folks are interested, but based on the builds in the official 4e module #6, I am considerably off the tracks
Since I am a fan of mechanics supporting this sort of thing instead of having a 'cause the DM thought it was right' approach, below is my initial stab at how to work this.
Note, I use Stalker0's Obsideon skill challenge system.
[sblock]
The Evil Party presents some non-combat options for defeating:
In combat skill challenges checks are a move action, so technically you can go for an action point and talk this combat into something else entirely. In both cases, this is more than only a skill check… the player has to provide a reasonable argument tailored to the NPC they are addressing.
Turning Katrina or Shalosha
Both these ladies are not sure of the rightness their place and can be convinced to switch sides (turning into companions for the remainder of the encounter). Mechanically, a diplomacy skill challenge with a DC of 36 goes as follows:
1 Success; target is marked by you and unable to attack you
2 Successes; Loss of conviction, Target weakened
3 Successes; Target becomes a companion
Katrina as companion will be lethally focused on slaying those she double-crossed as she knows her fate if they life to tell of her betrayal. (LE)
Shalosha as companion will prefer options of capturing or letting escape those she was with (LG).
Inquisitor Etienne can counter the successes with a Diplomacy or Bluff check of her own, vs DC 31 {needs an 11 or better}
Sowing seeds of discontent
- The key is the ‘Warriors of the Fourth Army’ vision, which shows Ursus battling Shahalestian warriors, and the presence of the monk acolyte. This foreshadows Pilus’ involvement in the in the upcoming battle, but also can be used as a wedge between the Shahalesti warriors {Nahrem, Rhiallis, Shalosha} and the Ragesian {Karedan, Ursus, and Etienne}.. possibly getting them to fight amongst themselves. Either approach of recalling the loss of the Shahalesti fleet ships at the hand of Pilus, or the blunt approach of Ursus battling their own.
Mechanically, this would be a Social skill challenge with Diplomacy as the primary skill. Again, the DC is 36 {Hard +5 due to being in combat}
2 success: No effect
3 successes: the two sides start treating each other as enemies for targeting purposes, but no active attacking… just accidental wounding. The DC reduces to 33.
4 successes: Split achieved! Shalosha becomes a companion, the others will choose based on location and recent activity on who to attack {the PCs could retreat at this point, or obviously side with one faction… but are still ‘enemies’ mechanically}
Again, Etienne can counter the successes with a DC 31 check of her own, {11 or better}
Katrina will side with the Ragesians, although she could still be turned.
[/sblock]
I appreciate any assistance on this.
I would post the badguys here if folks are interested, but based on the builds in the official 4e module #6, I am considerably off the tracks
