Trip, Disarm, Sunder

[Szatany]

I was thinking, in 3e those combat options are rather unwieldly and all provoke attacks of opportunity to balance them out - probably because without it they could solve various problems (like always sundering enemy weapon because it just defeats enemies faster).
Now, since we know that attacks of opportunity are going to be seriously altered, possibly being unable to perform the balancing function, and since we know that martial characters will gain per encounter abilities, do you think that attack options could be changed ?

I envision that those maneuvers will be usable x times per encounter but otherwise more powerful/less restricted. What do you think?

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

I expect they'll either become some sort of "combat maneuver" mechanic ... or they'll just be simpler -- as in: "Make an opposed attack roll at -4. If you beat the opponent, he's tripped/grappled/etc". Take feats to eliminate the penalty and give bonuses to action.

 

[Scribble]

They have mentioned "the sundering problem" in the past as part of the "things that cause unfun," so I'd expect to see them reworked or removed.

 

[Szatany]

They have mentioned "the sundering problem" in the past as part of the "things that cause unfun," so I'd expect to see them reworked or removed.

Please not removed. Make it difficult or make it usable rarely, but not gone.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Please not removed. Make it difficult or make it usable rarely, but not gone.

I doubt very much they'd be removed. Given what we've read of martial maneuvers (particularly those for fighters), I suspect very strongly that these special attack forms--disarm, sunder, etc.--will be maneuvers.

 

[Scribble]

Please not removed. Make it difficult or make it usable rarely, but not gone.

Shrug...

Maybe bundled into the fighter abilities or something...

 

[JustinA]

I doubt very much they'd be removed. Given what we've read of martial maneuvers (particularly those for fighters), I suspect very strongly that these special attack forms--disarm, sunder, etc.--will be maneuvers.

That would be awful, frankly.

But perhaps not unexpected. I've watched as the 3.5 splat-books have increasingly moved more and more actions which should be attemptable by anybody into the realm of "need a special class" or "need a special feat".

I consider this direction in design to be a complete dead-end. It seems foolish to move skills towards a "if you can think of it, you should be able to try it" direction while moving combat in the opposite direction.

Justin Alexander
http://www.thealexandrian.net

 

[Scribble]

That would be awful, frankly.

But perhaps not unexpected. I've watched as the 3.5 splat-books have increasingly moved more and more actions which should be attemptable by anybody into the realm of "need a special class" or "need a special feat".

I consider this direction in design to be a complete dead-end. It seems foolish to move skills towards a "if you can think of it, you should be able to try it" direction while moving combat in the opposite direction.

Justin Alexander
http://www.thealexandrian.net

How do you mean?

Do you think they'll remove the "trained only" skills from the game and make everything usable untrained?

As far as the special attacks, I can see them being only usable by certain classes (or those with access to certain powers...)

Anyone can kick someone but it takes a little more training to really do a sweep kick trip attack.

 

[Baron Opal]

They have mentioned "the sundering problem" in the past as part of the "things that cause unfun," so I'd expect to see them reworked or removed.

If the character is more important than the gear, it doesn't matter as much if the minotaur sunders your sword.

Well, you have to survive the minotaur, obviously, but once you get back to town...

 

[blargney the second]

If they stay, I hope that AoOs aren't tied to them any more. It added a whole layer of complexity that didn't make the game more fun to play.