Try it in your game? Remove caster level.

[Hassassin]

Spells that would normally improve with caster level (i.e. magic missile, scorching ray, create undead) don't.

How about dispel magic? Always 1d20 + 5, greater 1d20 + 11? Would Heighten increase the bonus? In that case Heighten would be sort of required to dispel anything at high levels.

BTW, I find all the monk bashing sort of hilarious when in our current low level game one of the monks is the most powerful combat character.

 

[Hassassin]

What he means is that the Monk's SR will protect him.

Monks also have a higher touch AC than most.

 

[kitcik]

Can I play the druid?

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

How does one play via enworld? I'm considering your proposal seriously.

I second this question, and would be interested. What classes are left unclaimed?

 

[the Jester]

How does one play via enworld? I'm considering your proposal seriously.

Play by post. There's a whole subforum for it.

 

[Dandu]

BTW, I find all the monk bashing sort of hilarious when in our current low level game one of the monks is the most powerful combat character.

Monks have many mechanical problems. This is a mathamatical fact. That doesn't mean that they can't be powerful relative to other characters; for example, the party could consist of Samurais, Truenamers, and Healers, or just be very badly run.

Mechanical problems (the short version):

• Multiple Attribute Dependency: You need Str for damage, Dex for Ref and AC, Con for Fort and HP, Wis for AC, Will, and monk abilities. That leaves Cha and Int as dump stats... but you probably want something in Int to take advantage of your monk skills...
• 3/4th BAB: While this is not a deal breaker - Clerics, Druids, and Psychic Warriors all have the same BAB - the monk has no way of buffing up to high heaven like the aforementioned classes.
• D8 hit dice: This is more a problem for the monk than the Cleric or Druid, both of whom can have high AC and HP.
• Lack of Reach: Reach is your friend.
• Lack of Synergistic Class Abilities

Hey, as long as I'm throwing down gauntlets, feel free to build a monk and we can have a duel - monks are, after all, "caster killers", right?

I'm for a level 13 , personally.

 

[Hassassin]

Monks have many mechanical problems. This is a mathamatical fact. That doesn't mean that they can't be powerful relative to other characters; for example, the party could consist of Samurais, Truenamers, and Healers, or just be very badly run.

Probably true. The party in question level 1-3, so most of the things you mention don't really come into play yet. The monk's player rolled by far the best ability scores, which also helps.

It just puts things into perspective, I guess.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Lack of Reach: Reach is your friend.

That gets addressed somewhat in certain supplements, like DCv1, some of the Eberron stuff, and a few of the FR variants from WotC, and in several 3PPs- I play reach monks a LOT.

There's even a couple of threads containing info about a "Dhalsim" build here on ENWorld.

 

[Visigani]

• Multiple Attribute Dependency: You need Str for damage, Dex for Ref and AC, Con for Fort and HP, Wis for AC, Will, and monk abilities. That leaves Cha and Int as dump stats... but you probably want something in Int to take advantage of your monk skills...

Hey, as long as I'm throwing down gauntlets, feel free to build a monk and we can have a duel - monks are, after all, "caster killers", right?

I'm for a level 13 , personally.

Doesn't your bullet point there largely describe virtually every class in the game. You know, like how Fighters need wisdom for will saves?


Why can't you just build a monk that's virtually identical to the kind of build you'd give a fighter in terms of stats and then focus on strength?

A lvl 20 two handed fighter with a base of 10 dex and a +6 dex item in +5 mithril fullplate (+9 Armor, +5 Enhancement +3 dex ) would have a base armor class of 27. A lvl 20 monk with base 10 dex and wis with +8 armor bracers, +6 dex item, +6 wisdom item would have base 28 ac. The monk may have spent a bit more for armor, but they also get more bang for their proverbial buck.

The fighter will do substantially more damage but he'll also require substantially more maintenance.

And this is operating in the fighters sphere. The fighter cannot then turn around and sneak about the place like a pro nor engage in any significant diplomatic actions, etc etc.

The silliness of it all is the expectation that the monk will surpass the rogue at being a rogue and the fighter at being a fighter when the monk was never intended to do either and if it did it would be an unbalanced class.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

A lvl 20 two handed fighter with a base of 10 dex and a +6 dex item in +5 mithril fullplate (+9 Armor, +5 Enhancement +3 dex ) would have a base armor class of 27. A lvl 20 monk with base 10 dex and wis with +8 armor bracers, +6 dex item, +6 wisdom item would have base 28 ac.

And a Lvl1 Githzerai monk (ECL3) can get AC 24-27 without any magic items. Just sayin'.