Two people dominate a monster; who gets to drive?

[jgsugden]

I had fun as a DM, a few years back, when the entire first level party was approached by various wings of an evil organization that used magic to force people to carry out their bidding. Each wing of the organization wanted the PCs to locate a rather simple looking object and bring it to that wing. None of the players knew that the other PCs were charmed, dominated, geased, etc ... to retrieve the same item. Watching them plot against each other to get the item away from the party, while simultaneously working with each other to get through the dungeon, was highly interesting ...

Hmmmm ... maybe I should revive that organization and have all the different wings try to use the same PC to carry out a mission?

 

[Ferret]

It also says that in the 3.5 phb on page 172.

 

[RigaMortus]

If you are in initiative, and the two conflicting commands are given within 1 round of one another, then it technically would be give simultaneously. It's all within the same six seconds...

 

[Hypersmurf]

If you are in initiative, and the two conflicting commands are given within 1 round of one another, then it technically would be give simultaneously. It's all within the same six seconds...

Somehow I doubt that the judges of a 100m sprint would consider "within the same six seconds" to be simultaneous.

If the commands "Kill him!" and "Don't kill me!" occur within the same round, can they really be considered simultaneous if the dominated creature gets a full attack in between the two?

Simultaneity and the turn-based mechanic are mutually exclusive. If a DM wishes to display simultaneity, he needs to deliberately discard the turn-based system for the duration of whatever's going on.

-Hyp.

 

[RigaMortus]

Somehow I doubt that the judges of a 100m sprint would consider "within the same six seconds" to be simultaneous.

If the commands "Kill him!" and "Don't kill me!" occur within the same round, can they really be considered simultaneous if the dominated creature gets a full attack in between the two?

Simultaneity and the turn-based mechanic are mutually exclusive. If a DM wishes to display simultaneity, he needs to deliberately discard the turn-based system for the duration of whatever's going on.

-Hyp.

But all the turn-based system is for, is so we aren't all rolling dice at the same time. It's a way for the players to take turns, not their characters. And yes, while it's within the same 6 seconds, thats really close enough. That's the smallest "breakdown" in time they gave us. So whose to say that the commands don't go through on the same second within those 6 seconds?

I do see your point though, if the target of the command goes in between the two "commanders". Then it would not be simultaneous.

 

[Hypersmurf]

And yes, while it's within the same 6 seconds, thats really close enough. That's the smallest "breakdown" in time they gave us. So whose to say that the commands don't go through on the same second within those 6 seconds?

It's not quite the smallest breakdown. Compare attacks that provoke Concentration checks. "Within the same round" isn't "at the same time"; "at the same time" required an AoO or a Readied Action.

That's the closest to simultaneity that the turn-based system gets - closer than "within the same round".

-Hyp.

 

[Tatsukun]

Simple example:

1st dominators initiative: Order: kill other dominator.
2nd dominators initiative: kill first dominator.
Monsters initiative... monster waits for opposed Cha check.

Right?

Well, in that case, he can do both so no problem. Rampage ! !

-Tatsu

 

[Kodam]

Hi!

Well, in that case, he can do both so no problem. Rampage ! !

-Tatsu

Alright, but the CHA-check would determine who's the first target...

Kodam

 

[Norfleet]

Hi!
Alright, but the CHA-check would determine who's the first target...
Kodam

Naw. The dominated victim will attempt to kill the most accessible person, which is probably whoever is closest. Upon successfully killing the other victim, since one of the casters is now dead, he's no longer compelled to follow his orders, and so he stops. If the dominated victim can kill both of them at once, such as with an area attack, he might do that, as well.

 

[WizarDru]

I'd assume that when they refer to getting commands simultaneously, they're referring either to a potential situation where the monster gets commands simultaneously for the monster, or for a situation involving readied actions.

PC 1 (Init 8): Do X!
NPC 2 (Init 7): No, Do Y!
Monster (Init 2): Urk!

or

PC 1 (init 10): I ready an action to countermand any order the NPC gives.
NPC (init 7): Do Y!
PC 1 (using readied action): NO! Do X!
Monster (Init 2): Urg!!