Ultimate Digital Gaming Table

[Majoru Oakheart]

So, I'm planning on making the ultimate digital gaming table based on ideas I've seen from around the net and posted here. I haven't made it yet, and it is still in the planning stages, but I figured I'd post my progress here and give people a chance to give me some ideas.

Here is the plan so far:

-102" x 68" table with a 78" x 44" touchscreen built in(there will be 1 foot of extra space around the touchscreen itself)

-There will be 8 "Player Stations" around the outside and 1 DM station, similar to the Sultan table(if anyone has seen it), each of which will have a fold out area to put books, character sheet, etc.

-A number of drink holders and drawers around the outside for storage

-The touchscreen will be constructed using Diffused Surface Illumination (DSI). For those who don't know, the technique involves shining IR LEDs into the side of a piece of EndLighten Acrylic and viewing it with a modified webcam with the IR filter removed

-The picture of the screen will be rear projected using a LCD projector and some mirrors in order to get the throw distance to project large enough

-I will use MapTool(for now, unless someone can suggest a better software), possibly getting some programmer friends of mine to modify it to accept multitouch input

-Phase 2 of my plan involves using fiducials attached to the bottom of D&D miniatures in order to identify the type of creature it is and automatically look up the stats of the creature and put it into MapTool. It will also enable players to move their characters simply by moving their minis.

-Outside of the room I need to project a battlemap, there is room for the players to write notes and keep track of hitpoints and the like using Microsoft OneNote or another program.

 

[AJCarrington]

Sounds simply awesome - I'd love to be able to play at a table like that. You might want to consider some random die rollers (d6/d20/d8/etc.); player simply "presses a button" for an attack role/save/etc. Not sure if people would like to give up actually "rolling" their own dice, but it would be an interesting option.

AJC

 

[azhrei_fje]

So, I'm planning on making the ultimate digital gaming table based on ideas I've seen from around the net and posted here.

[...]

-The touchscreen will be constructed using Diffused Surface Illumination (DSI). For those who don't know, the technique involves shining IR LEDs into the side of a piece of EndLighten Acrylic and viewing it with a modified webcam with the IR filter removed

-The picture of the screen will be rear projected using a LCD projector and some mirrors in order to get the throw distance to project large enough

Be aware that the mirror will require space underneath the table and you'll need to plan the player stations at the mirror end of the table to allow for leg/knee room. Be sure to draw this out to scale and then, if you have the chance, build a mockup to test it out.

Legroom is probably the biggest stumbling block I've seen in gaming tables that have under-table hardware...

-I will use MapTool(for now, unless someone can suggest a better software), possibly getting some programmer friends of mine to modify it to accept multitouch input

I'm the moderator and co-admin of the RPTools.net forum. We would love to have additional software support for multitouch. If your developer friends would like to discuss the issues, I'd love to chat with them. (I'm Azhrei over there.)

I think MapTool is an excellent choice for this. In many cases, you wouldn't need miniatures at all -- just drag your finger across the surface of the table and watch the token on the map count out the distance you've moved. Very cool!

-Phase 2 of my plan involves using fiducials attached to the bottom of D&D miniatures in order to identify the type of creature it is and automatically look up the stats of the creature and put it into MapTool. It will also enable players to move their characters simply by moving their minis.

We have plans to integrate InitTool more closely with MapTool. And InitTool has the SRD database in it already. Again, before you start this phase of your table, be sure to post a message on the RPTools.net forums and let us know so we can help you plan it.

-Outside of the room I need to project a battlemap, there is room for the players to write notes and keep track of hitpoints and the like using Microsoft OneNote or another program.

You realize that MapTool has user-programmable macros and can maintain that information for you by defining macros to do the math and manage the resulting numbers?

Sounds simply awesome - I'd love to be able to play at a table like that. You might want to consider some random die rollers (d6/d20/d8/etc.); player simply "presses a button" for an attack role/save/etc. Not sure if people would like to give up actually "rolling" their own dice, but it would be an interesting option.

AJC

It would be simple to provide simple die-roll macros along one edge of the MapTool screen. Since it's a touch screen surface, just pressing your finger on the visual would execute the macro.

There are a lot of people on the RPTools.net forums that have created entire MapTool campaigns that are automated using macros. So click a macro button to roll attacks, make a skill check, and so on.

What I think would be cool about this surface would be the drawing of "blast templates" (or whatever you choose to call them) for circles, lines, cones, and so forth. It would be great to be able to just drag your finger to see where they would end up...

The primary issue I see with using MapTool for this application is the number of instances where MapTool requires a modifier key. For example, Shift-drag when resizing an image to constrain the ratio, or Ctrl-drag to force snap-to-grid when drawing shapes.

 

[Majoru Oakheart]

Yeah, there needs to be some code added to MapTool to support some gestures. For instance, using two fingers in order to resize things. This would solve some of the problems. Although, I am planning on using my tablet PC in order to keep GM notes and view the map in GM mode. While keeping the table set to view in Player mode.

As for the mirror problems...I agree. I've managed to find an EXTREMELY short throw projector. I may be able to, using a wide angle lens and this projector keep the depth of the table to 12" or so. Meaning that there would be as much leg room as a normal table. It is rather expensive, and is probably going to increase the budget on the table pretty dramatically. But, after investigating the price of large, single surface mirrors, it may not be THAT much more expensive. It is the Sanyo PLC-XL51.

My current issue is how to get a camera to see an entire 90" diagonal 16:9 screen from only 12" away. I am trying to find a wide angle lens that is wide enough.

The other issue I am considering is that the 1 foot of space around the screen might be too much for people to reach the middle of the screen. Right now, there are 2 possible solutions to this: Reduce the size of the screen OR reduce the size of the area around the screen. I'm leaning towards the latter. Unfortunately, this means abandoning my idea of fold out player stations. In exchange, I could just encourage everyone to use the table itself as their characters sheet/notepad/books. If I keep all the books in digital form, open copies of OneNote to display character sheets and give people the ability to write on them, and so on...well, that means no need for physical books and characters sheets at all.

There is a program out there that lets you resize and rotate programs within windows with a touch screen. I can have everyone's character sheets facing them and extend the screen almost all the way to the edge.

However, I may end up ALSO reducing the screen by a couple of inches on each side. Mostly because the projector is only 1024x768 and I'm not sure how blurry text will be at that size.

 

[azhrei_fje]

Yeah, there needs to be some code added to MapTool to support some gestures. For instance, using two fingers in order to resize things. This would solve some of the problems. Although, I am planning on using my tablet PC in order to keep GM notes and view the map in GM mode. While keeping the table set to view in Player mode.

There are Java library issues here as well, concerning the Toolkit's definition of the menuShortcut keystroke. It might be possible to intercept the event queue and replace the custom InputEvent fields with values that would mimic a typical mouse/keyboard...

The other issue I am considering is that the 1 foot of space around the screen might be too much for people to reach the middle of the screen.

You might try angling the edges so that books would "stand up" along the edge of the table. This might not be convenient for ordinary sheets of paper but would probably be fine for books and such. I'm thinking of 60-degree inclines with a ledge at the bottom to hold the book.

Or, since you're building a custom table anyway (!), how about the outer edge being transparent and then the books and other notes being under the tabletop. Since the book would be a few inches below the table and angled, you could probably get away with 6"-8" of depth instead of 12" (maybe not enough of a difference). I like this solution because you could install compact fluorescent lights below the outer lip...

Sounds like this'll be a cool table when you're done. Be sure to take lots of photos and construction notes because you'll be the envy of thousands of gamers on the 'net!

 

[Bleoberis De Ganis]

The other issue I am considering is that the 1 foot of space around the screen might be too much for people to reach the middle of the screen. Right now, there are 2 possible solutions to this: Reduce the size of the screen OR reduce the size of the area around the screen. I'm leaning towards the latter. Unfortunately, this means abandoning my idea of fold out player stations. In exchange, I could just encourage everyone to use the table itself as their characters sheet/notepad/books. If I keep all the books in digital form, open copies of OneNote to display character sheets and give people the ability to write on them, and so on...well, that means no need for physical books and characters sheets at all.

If you build directional keys (by using old knackered keyboards perhaps) into each player station (or between stations for sharing), the players could use these to move the map so they wont need to reach. All the keyboards could just input into the (share) same port so you wont have to have all your usbs taken up. Not an electronics expert - but I bet it could be done with a little effort.

If you were to add a back/cancel key you could have them operate a menu system like on a mobile phone or television.

Enter to open menu or select next menu item. Directional to select menu item. Cancel/back to - well do what it says on the tin.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I'm the moderator and co-admin of the RPTools.net forum. We would love to have additional software support for multitouch. If your developer friends would like to discuss the issues, I'd love to chat with them. (I'm Azhrei over there.)

I am not sure if this would be of any help for Java applications, but Microsoft is expanding the Touch Support in Windows 7 considerably, with a better API. (And .NET 4.0s WPF will also come with the appropriate events and so on to handle touch, and in the mean-time, an SDK will cover that apparantly.)

I suspect that there will be more to come from non-Microsoft companies soo, too.


Yes, I am a developer, but unfortunately, I am still pretty "married" to the Microsoft world and its technologies. I am expanding in C++ and QT these days due to my job, and we are going "cross-platform" there, but still no Java.

 

[Matt James]

Any follow up to this? I am actually looking to mimic the successes of others in building my own rig.

 

[falcarrion]

If you go to the nui group you can get a lot of information on multi touch tables. They can give you info on cameras to use. It is great group of people.
Also check out the WII remote project. I was able to move the figures in maptools with a ir pen on my computer screen by using a WII remote. The WII remote has a built in ir camera. Down load the software aim the remote at the screen.
I also am planning on building a multitouch table. But being unemployeed has stopped me for now.

 

[falcarrion]

NUI Group - Natural User Interface Group

Wiimote Project