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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Lanliss" data-source="post: 7712831" data-attributes="member: 6801219">Just googled Warlock Definition. "A man who practices Witchcraft; A sorcerer". Nothing about Evil. The Merriam-Webster site says it is "A man who practices the Black Arts", but that is what all magic that wasn't "Cleric" based was called, so I don't put much stock in that. Looked through all of the flavor bits on the opening page for Warlock in the PHB. No mention of Evil. The closest thing it gets to saying patrons are bad is "Mysterious beings" in the last paragraph of the first section. Also, the "Sworn and Beholden" section even says that the relationship can be the same as that of a Cleric and their Deity. I think the primary difference is in how Ambiguous the patron/Deity is. An absolute force of Evil would be more like a Deity, IMO, while something that has motives that actually change once-in-a-thousand-years is more like a Patron. A fiend might want souls to power it, or want you to bring down his competitor so he can bring a kinder side to the 9 hells. An Archfey might want you to collect beautiful slaves for her, or want you to pick some flowers every month. Deities have a specific, pre-determined goal, the force behind their godhood, and woe betide the cleric who wavers from that path.Looking over the domain spell, you may be right that they are a bit much to give as an at-will. Maybe just bonuses to those spells will work, since a Cleric will be guaranteed to have them anyway. Things like Bless being a d6, or Faerie fire having a +2 to the DC. I don't know, I will think a bit harder another time. As for playing one, I might get a chance eventually, and I am not so stubborn as to refuse to try it jsut because I don't like the looks of it. I just need to find the story I want to tell for a Cleric. Many things cannot be stopped at the table level as easily as saying "No shenanigans". I don't imagine there are many DMs who think "Attacking" is a problem, and so ban it at their table. However, things like this are clearly shenanigans, and not something a person in the world would stop their world saving quest to spend a day doing. I cannot even imagine a player actually saying he is going to try this exploit, and most well adjusted adults would just say OK if asked to stop. I feel like us butting heads on this topic isn't going to lead anywhere beyond a circle, and is getting in the way of the more constructive discussion happening in the top half of our posts, so I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on the matter. If they change it to some sort of Locked spell slot system, I will use this one instead. I am sure if they don't change it You will just tell your players No when they try to pull something stupid. You seem like a reasonable person that way.</blockquote>

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