D&D 5E (2024) Unfreezing the Narrative

[Willie the Duck]

This seems like more things to track and more tactical considerations to take into account (both for you and your opponent), and could potentially exacerbate the wait between turns that make a 'miss' turn so frustrating. I can see the reason to want it, but one would have to be very sure that the juice is worth the squeeze.

Note also that, as long as combat rounds can get, 5e tends to give (or at least allow) multiple, often non-interdependent actions per round. If you are the type of player that really chaffs at having no impact, you can make a character that has a hard time not doing anything. Star druids can do their main thing, but then almost always use a bonus action to shoot (not dependent on rest of actions being an attack). Reach fighters with Sentinel or Polearm Master regularly get an activity on their opponent's turn. Anyone with a 'pet' (class feature, magic item, spell, or 'and you play the NPC') can get a whole second set of actions, sometimes costing part of your action, sometimes not.

Regardless, I think this might be better for developing a new game (where you can put the 'or on a miss' math into the development of each ability). Current abilities that grant nothing on a miss/successful-save-against are generally pretty strong, and granting a uniform bonus to them* is probably not the most balanced thing for the game as-is.
*that isn't of trivial value, and if so then what's the point?

That said, it is not, in and of itself, a bad idea. Building effects with effect A on a success and lesser effect B on a failure is a nice model, one that D&D does rarely (usually in the form of damaging/hostile effects which are still rough terrain even if resisted).

 

[jmartkdr2]

If this is a recurring problem at you table, a less radical solution might be more than enough: the Whiff Die

Every time you miss, you gain a +1 bonus to hit on your next attack roll. This clears once you hit. Use a big die to remind yourself of the bonus.

Eventually, you'll hit.

(If you want something even less balance-affecting, only grant the bonus when all attacks on a turn miss.)

 

[Lanefan]

So, 4e-style "damage on a miss" all over again, only this time with optional extras?

No thanks. A miss is a miss, get on with the game.

 

[Distracted DM]

I understand wanting to make every turn feel good for the players- personally I think there are bigger fun-suckers for the game (like the Stunned condition), but I think something like damage-on-a-miss still feels cruddy for players unless it happens to KO a target with a few HP left.

Missing frequently can be offset by using Kobold Press'/ToV's Luck instead of Inspiration. Miss or fail a save = 1 luck, luck can be added to d20 rolls or 3pts for a reroll.

 

[mamba]

Imagine if the Attack action itself had some impact even if you missed, maybe tied to the class, and deferred to level 4-6 to avoid multiclass dip tempations.

I’d go the route of multiple success tiers, not sure we need a pure miss, but I am ok with a fumble that does something negative (for martials and spells…)

 

[mamba]

The challenge with so many of these ideas is that they encroach on other spells, feats, actions, or abilities that do something similar and therefore devalues them

eh, we gave way too much room to spells, time to reclaim some

 

[Tonguez]

I think that if your narrative is freezing then you are doing it wrong

Even if PCs miss a strike, there ought to be enough happening that the battlefield is dynamic, creatures flinch or duck, objectives get closer or further away, people stumble, clocks tick and characters have time to move or use a reaction or set up for the next turn

 

[Lakesidefantasy]

I understand wanting to make every turn feel good for the players- personally I think there are bigger fun-suckers for the game (like the Stunned condition), but I think something like damage-on-a-miss still feels cruddy for players unless it happens to KO a target with a few HP left.

Missing frequently can be offset by using Kobold Press'/ToV's Luck instead of Inspiration. Miss or fail a save = 1 luck, luck can be added to d20 rolls or 3pts for a reroll.

In the Conan 2d20 system there is an interesting mechanic that every time we fail we add a token or die to a pile in the center of the table. These can be used by any Player to give their Character an advantage. It is kind of fun to watch that pile grow.

If we think Dungeons and Dragons is already too easy to "win" then this is not something we would probably want to add. But, if we like winning then this might be something we would like to add.

My concern is adding more complexity by adding more rules. Giving more options can do the opposite of what we would like to achieve by increasing the likelihood of analysis paralysis.

 

[TorgoTheWhite]

I think I disagree with the premise, that a single miss in combat creates a frozen narrative. If the state of play hasn't changed between the start and the end of the players' turn, that's on them -- they have the opportunity to move, and often they have bonus actions (which are a clunky mechanism in some ways, but work against this concern specifically).

You miss, play moves on. Accept the loss. But it's simply not the case that "the turn could have been skipped": you have a chance to do damage, and you've taken your chance. Just because you don't like the result of a miss doesn't mean your turn could have been skipped. So it's not "frozen".

And as for "narrative": your character might have been hacking away and unable to penetrate the rapid shield blocks of an enemy; or your sword could have been levered between the jaws of your opponent, that was snapping down; or whatever. That's action, and that's story, there for the invention if you want it; it just happens not to do a d6 of damage.

I typically find a way to put action into missed opportunities.. or action into taking hits. Sometimes a change of perspective can help "unfreeze" a narrative

 

[doctorbadwolf]

You could introduce mixed results so that only a very bad roll leads to this dead turn issue.

It does require more DC (and AC) transparency, but it is worth it.

So a miss within 5 of the dc is a partial hit or glancing blow, and that has some sort of small effect still, like allowing you to reposition or get a brief defense buff.