Unhappy w/4E monster manual..3PP pls. publish monster books pronto!!

[Pbartender]

I don't think creating new 4e monsters is as easy as some people in this thread are saying. If this was the case, then D&D forums would be bursting with 4e monster stats. And there wouldn't be threads like this, complaining about the lack of monsters in the 4e MM.

...

There needs to be a better website dedicated to 4e monsters. If it's so ridiculously easy for some people to conjure monster stats, I'd sure love to see them all in one place.

You need to remember that when we (or rather, when I) talk about "reskinning", it doesn't have anything to do with creating new stats or monsters. For me, at least, it simply means reworking the fluff -- entirely new descriptions for their physical appearance and perhaps new descriptions for their powers -- while leaving the mechanical stats practically untouched.

So, I might think to myself, "I need a tribe of Aztec-like warriors". I take a peek through the MM, and decide that the ferocious berserker qualities of orcs are a good fit for the sort of fanatical recklessness in combat that devotion to a god that demands blood sacrifices engenders.

I simply describe them as typical mesoamerican tribal humans. The leather and hide armor of most orcs gets described as the quilted ichcahuipilli coats aztec warriors wore. The chieftain's chain mail gets described as a tlahuiztli, a close-fitting full body-suit made of leopard skin, or brightly colored feathers. And axes become wood and obsidian macuahuitl.

That's the sort of thing I'm talking about.

Another example... Describing a Deathjump Spider as a Giant Poison Dart Frog. No changes to mechanics necessary, aside from eliminating the "spider" subtype.

 

[avin]

I'm looking for new MOnster Manuals, but not these "1 rat, 1 ogre, 12 beholders, 3 celestials" nonsense.

I miss the fluff a lot.

 

[avin]

Do you have any specific critters from 3e or 1e you wanted converted? I'd be happy to do so on a case-by-case, because pages 184 and 185 of the DMG make it obscenely easy.

Have you worked on Raggamoffins (spell)? I was wondering about it's possession to be something like Night Hag's.

 

[Filcher]

I'm looking for new MOnster Manuals, but not these "1 rat, 1 ogre, 12 beholders, 3 celestials" nonsense.

I miss the fluff a lot.

Check out this thread. Blackdirge seems to be offering up what we're interested in:

http://www.enworld.org/forum/genera...oodman-games-embracing-d-d-4th-edition-2.html

 

[Mishihari Lord]

My biggest problem with the MM is also the lack of fluff. It's very little help if you want to do anything besides kill the monsters in a straight-up fight. If you want to negotiate, poison them, sneak around them, scare them, psych them out, or whatever it's very little help. A bit along the lines of the old "Ecology" dragon articles would be very helpful. It would also make the monsters much more interesting.

 

[avin]

Check out this thread. Blackdirge seems to be offering up what we're interested in:

http://www.enworld.org/forum/genera...oodman-games-embracing-d-d-4th-edition-2.html

I will follow it.

I'm glad Creature Collection is going 4ed too!

 

[Blair Goatsblood]

Well, it didn't take very long for me to get fed up with 4E; nowadays I play AD&D and retro-clones, and between my old D&D manuals, old issues of Dragon Magazine, The Arduin Trilogy, Swords & Wizardry Monster Book, Carcosa, Realms of Crawling Chaos, The Esoteric Random Creature Generator, and lots of great creations from OSR/oldschool blogs and forums I have an embarrassment of pulp sword & sorcery monster riches to plunder for my D&D/D&D-ish games.

Another great thing about the OSR products is that I can print out my PDFs in digest-sized format (5.5" x 8.5") and fit a TON of gaming resources into my "grief-case".

Everyone has their own preferences and tastes, but I thank 4E for sending me running into the OSR; since switching to old-school play the games I DM and play in are faster, furious and funner! The other players all embraced the conversion, although one player prefers 3E and may start DMing 3E or Pathfinder...I gave him my (beloved) Tomb of Horrors as a present...I'll be getting the Swords & Wizardry Tomb of Horrors compilation when it's published as a replacement.

 

[Ulrick]

Nice update.

I quit 4e for a similar reason (along with many others).

Even to this day the 4e monsters still don't have that Old School feel.

It also fun to throw hordes of low-level monsters at PCs in older editions of D&D without having to resort to using "minions." That 4e "1 hp" rule just seems to dampen the sense of achievement after the hordes are defeated. That, and they don't take an hour of game time to kill.

 

[Dice4Hire]

It also fun to throw hordes of low-level monsters at PCs in older editions of D&D without having to resort to using "minions." That 4e "1 hp" rule just seems to dampen the sense of achievement after the hordes are defeated. That, and they don't take an hour of game time to kill.

If they die in one hit, then what is the difference if they have one hit point or 2, 3 or 5?

I remember 1E stat blocks, "10 kobolds HD 1/2 HP 1,1,1,2,2,2,3,3,4,4" well.

I am a bit surprised there has been so little 2pp on he monster front. I know there has been some, but I have not seen much.

But then again, I think we have enough monsters in 4E, especially with how easy they are to reskin.

 

[Herremann the Wise]

If they die in one hit, then what is the difference if they have one hit point or 2, 3 or 5?

I remember 1E stat blocks, "10 kobolds HD 1/2 HP 1,1,1,2,2,2,3,3,4,4" well.

I know this may sound silly but to me the difference in philosophy here between D&D and D&D4e is what has caused most of the angst between supporters/haters of each of the editions. The 1,1,1,2,2,2,3,3,4,4 kobolds while effectively the same as the 1hp minion kobolds (think that whole black box 4e philosophy here), is different in terms of the information their hps represent. Those two 4hp guys are most likely considered the toughest by their peers while the 1hp dudes get kicked around by everyone in the clan. This most likely effects how they act in combat as well (with either the 4hp kobolds valiantly charging into the fray or resolutely pushing all their lessers to the front). There is also a chance (be it rather small) that the 2-4hp kobolds could survive a hit; and thus achieving heroic status amongst the clan.

4e takes the line that tracking such things is one more thing that the DM does not need to do. Functionally they may as well just have 1hp and everyone can get through their combat encounters more efficiently. For some this need for gamist efficiency left 4e with a huge hole in feel and gameplay. For others, the game was finally getting rid of the unnecessary minutiae and baggage that 3e in particular drove them insane with.

So while functionally what you have presented may appear to be the same, looking into it further I think highlights how far apart the two situations are.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise