[URBIS] Another take on mind flayers

[Jürgen Hubert]

if the host creature is larger than the average member of the host species, then use the minimum number of hit dice possible for a member of the host species of this size

Why?

The situation in D&D with creature Hit Dice and experience is a bit messy. On one hand, I didn't want to give an illithid-converted creature extra hit dice because it had a few character levels. On the other hand, bigger base creatures are going to result in tougher illithids...

I think I'll rewrite it that the illithid has the same number of Hit Dice as the host creature, or the minimum number for its size listed in the template - but any character levels do not count for this. Would that be better?

The illithid gains a base attack bonus equal to its total HD x 3 / 4 (as a cleric)

I wouldn't do that; base attack bonus is determined by type and number of hit dice. If you break that link, you risk confusion. Why?

That's actually what happens - the illithid has the base attack bonus appropriate to an aberration of its number of hit dice. Perhaps I should just say this outright in the BAB, Feats, and Skill sections instead of expressing it this way...

Its base Intelligence and Charisma depend on the size of the host creature.

Why?

My reasoning is that Intelligence (and Charisma) is, in case of mind flayers, a function of brain size. And a larger host creature is able to support a larger brain case...

Overall, I find that the substitution of feats, skills, mental scores, and such, is a bit clunky. Maybe it'd be better to have the final creature retain something of the host.

Essentially, most of the host bodies physiological processes remain intact, but the neural networks are completely "rewired", so to speak. And this is what I wanted to achieve with this template, though I admit I'll have to clarify this a bit more...

 

[Zappo]

I think I'll rewrite it that the illithid has the same number of Hit Dice as the host creature, or the minimum number for its size listed in the template - but any character levels do not count for this. Would that be better?

That sounds better, yes.

That's actually what happens - the illithid has the base attack bonus appropriate to an aberration of its number of hit dice.

Ah... my fault. I understood that he would gain the BAB - as in, add it to that he already has.

My reasoning is that Intelligence (and Charisma) is, in case of mind flayers, a function of brain size. And a larger host creature is able to support a larger brain case...

That makes one wonder why the mind flayers would mostly be humanoid. Why not make every new illithid from, say, ogres, or hill giants, or elephants, or any of a host of Large and Huge sized creatures?

Essentially, most of the host bodies physiological processes remain intact, but the neural networks are completely "rewired", so to speak. And this is what I wanted to achieve with this template, though I admit I'll have to clarify this a bit more...

It makes sense, but as it is now, it's a bit clunky rule-wise.

 

[Jürgen Hubert]

That makes one wonder why the mind flayers would mostly be humanoid. Why not make every new illithid from, say, ogres, or hill giants, or elephants, or any of a host of Large and Huge sized creatures?

Two reasons:

First, I gave each host creature a Fortitude (DC 25) save to resist the conversion process (this is described in full in the House Rules thread). This gives larger creatures a good chance to resist conversion - and depending on how rare the larvae are, the result might not be worth the loss (and for really large critters, the mind flayers have to reduce their Fortitude save through magical and/or psionic means to make it even possible...).

Second, there is the question of food. Brains aren't exactly a common resource, and even medium-size mind flayers have to ration their slaves carefully. Can you imagine how many brains a larger creature would need? Sooner or later, you are going to need more humanoid food slaves than you can keep under control...

Sure, an illithid cities will have a few larger-than-average mind flayers. But Medium-Sized ones will remain in the majority.

 

[SpuneDagr]

Does this template added to a human result in the mind flayer from the MM? That's probably a good benchmark for its powers.

 

[Jürgen Hubert]

Does this template added to a human result in the mind flayer from the MM? That's probably a good benchmark for its powers.

It should - I designed it this way, and if it doesn't, I made a mistake somewhere...