Vampires and Disintegrate, does it destroy it? + Libris Mortis question

[Nordic Birch]

So, what happens if a vampire is hit by a Disintegrate spell and fails the save... does he turn into gaseous form and returns to his coffin or is he destroyed outright?

Well, one could argue that being disintegrated counts as removing the creatures head. (Although the specifics of head removal are a bit vague in the srd. Is the holy wafer essential, do you need to destroy the body as well etc.)

 

[Torin Ironfist]

It seems to me that either way, the vampire is in trouble. If the Disintegrate spell were to function before the vampires ability to transform than i don't see the dust pile turning into a gaseous cloud and floating away, and if the vamp changes first then the Disintegrate was applied the gaseous cloud would be... disintegrated. Even if the cloud were to still be "alive" i would rule that it wouldn't be able to travel, just lay on the ground as a pile of molecules until the 2 hours had passed which btw would be a cool way to make him/her suffer. In the end there is no actual rule, so it's falls to whatever the dm wants, but I don't think i agree with the sunbeam spell having an impact as it was not created specifically as a vampire killer, just a powerful undead killer, with the notable exception that sunbeam will bypass the vamps ability to float away.

I could see it going the other direction though, being able to instantly kill its body, but not actually kill it... still makes it a powerful vamp killer, just requires followup.

 

[Haffrung Helleyes]

good question

I am surprised that the disintegrate question hasn't been asked in Sage Advice.

The second question is easy. As others have said, unnamed bonuses stack.


Ken

 

[Vahktang]

Seems to me disintigrate is the really, really fun way to off one of the most troublesome monsters around.
Hit the beastie, it's gone.

 

[Goobermunch]

However, a twinked vampire with a bag of tricks that drains all animals he can find right before a battle might gain a huge bonus - but not to damage, only to hit.

There's a feat that's just sprung to my mind. What if you could convert your to hit bonus to damage some how? That'd be awesome!

--G

 

[Doug Sundseth]

Here's the full text from the Hypertext d20 SRD:

Stacking

In most cases, modifiers to a given check or roll stack (combine for a cumulative effect) if they come from different sources and have different types (or no type at all), but do not stack if they have the same type or come from the same source (such as the same spell cast twice in succession). If the modifiers to a particular roll do not stack, only the best bonus and worst penalty applies. Dodge bonuses and circumstance bonuses however, do stack with one another unless otherwise specified.

(Emphasis added.)

The bonuses are from the same source, are not dodge or circumstance bonuses, and don't explicitly say that they stack. As I read the rules, that means they don't stack.

 

[glass]

As for Improved Energy Drain from Libris Mortis: the bonus is an untyped bonus, so I believe they would stack for each negative level. So a vampire's slam attack, with successful energy drain, should give you a +2 bonus to skill checks/ability checks/saves.

Bonuses from the same source never stack, untyped or not.


glass.

 

[eamon]

Bonuses from the same source never stack, untyped or not.

That does sound like the best ruling. It bugs me a little thematically, since the idea presumably is that the vampire gorges himself (and grows stronger) by feeding on life, but D&D doesn't really have a means to grow consistently stronger without quickly being easily abused (there's no mechanic for diminishing returns).

 

[evilbob]

The bonuses are from the same source, are not dodge or circumstance bonuses, and don't explicitly say that they stack. As I read the rules, that means they don't stack.

Wow - good catch. I'd have to agree that this seems like the best way to interpret this rule, although it does make a very nice and powerful ability far less useful.

As for the further comments on disentegrate: the "turns to dust" thing happens after a creature is taken to zero HP. The vampire's ability kicks in after it is taken to zero HP and specifically negates further damage. Chicken or egg?

 

[eamon]

As for the further comments on disentegrate: the "turns to dust" thing happens after a creature is taken to zero HP. The vampire's ability kicks in after it is taken to zero HP and specifically negates further damage. Chicken or egg?

Disintegrate's "total destruction" doesn't kick in specifically after a creature being reduced to 0hp, but if it's reduced to 0 hp. It's an instantaneous effect, and I see no reason to split it into to separate effects - rather, the intent of the disintegrate mechanics seem to be that a creature is utterly destroyed - except if it has more than X hp, in which case it loses X hp.

The question is whether a vampire can survive the turn-to-dust effect of disintegrate. The way I read it, a vampire only has protection against plain old normal death by hitpoint damage - not to being destroyed by high-level turn undead, and not to being destroyed by disintegrate; against these things a vampire is vulnerable as normal.