WotBS Warlock, primordial patron

This really annoys me, I know I should fine it, but coming up empty handed.
The Campaign Guide mentions warlocks with "The Primordial" patrons, referencing the kraken, worm, dragon and Avilona as examples (pg. 18, 5e version).

I feel dumb, but shouldn't there be some detail on primordial patrons somewhere in WotBS? I can't find any anywhere (nor on that famous website with all 5e related material). I'm at a loss...
 

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emeraldbeacon

Adventurer
It's a bit of a hunt to find them, honestly... those particular patrons are specific to the WotBS adventure path. Their full names are given in Chapter 10:
  • Silesh-el-Mavisha, the Tidereaver Kraken (patron of water)
  • Thuuga-el-Shembul, the Worldshaper Worm (patron of earth, whom also originated the Song of Forms)
  • Jhial-el-Avilona, the Stormchaser Eagle (patron of air, whom is effectively dead)
  • Khor-el-Jiese, the Flamebringer Dragon (patron of fire, whom will not contact the heroes)
I imagine that you could use any primordial concept for this, though, and craft your own entity... a spirit of nature & growth could take issue with the fires of Innenotdar; a winter primordial may actually oppose the restoration of "The Torch;" a spirit of death and decay might take issue with the undead roaming the halls of Castle Korstull. Furthermore, the being known as "Time" that appears at the end of Chapter 12 is akin to the psychic offspring, born of the conflict between the Stormchaser and Flamebringer... it is a more abstract concept, but nonetheless a primordial in its own right.

I wouldn't mind an "advanced" sourcebook for the region as a whole that fleshes out the setting... the creation myths could be developed to a degree, the full story of Toteth Topec could be examined, and the political events that created the world of the AP could be explored.
 

Wait, OK, yes, hang on, uhm... That didn't clear up much for me, sorry (I know that's me being dense, don't worry).
Let's stick with 'Primordial' as a term first. IS that actually the term of the Warlock subclass, like, say 'Great Old One',or 'Undead'? Or am I looking for 'Air', 'Fire' what have you?

As a side: the names you mentioned are very well in the Campaign Guide, but what I can't find is the crunch for 'I want to make a Primordial Warlock'. :)
 

Fuzzybear

Explorer
I think you're looking to get a little too specific. I would argue that it is within your realm to define how to fit these entities into the warlock pacts. If I remember right, doesn't one of @Tolamaker 's PCs use a pact with one of the spirits as well? Perhaps they could give more insight into how they are doing it. Otherwise I wouldn't be against using the fiend (for dragon), fathomless (for kraken), or the great old one or hexblade (for really any of them). I would just figure out which one was wanted and then tailor the aspects of it to fit with the spirit that best aligns with them. I don't think you're going to get a step by step guide for building each of the potential patrons in the campaign guide.
 

Tolamaker

Explorer
Unfortunately, my player's patron is a completely homebrew (by the player) Fey Lady of the Moon. I might end up tying her to the Tidereaver Kraken, due to the connection between the moon and shapeshifting, but I haven't quite figured that out yet.
 

OK, that would already help. 'Primordial' not as an existing subclass that I'm too blind to find (or that's somehow missing or hidden deep in some chapter I haven't bought yet), but as a loose in-world concept for me to adapt to existing subclasses or a homebrew.
I could work with that. :)

@Tolamaker thanks for your input as well.
 

Salicus

Explorer
OK, that would already help. 'Primordial' not as an existing subclass that I'm too blind to find (or that's somehow missing or hidden deep in some chapter I haven't bought yet), but as a loose in-world concept for me to adapt to existing subclasses or a homebrew.
I could work with that. :)

@Tolamaker thanks for your input as well.
Well actually there is a subclass in the Players Guide named Primordial. And it gives some Insight together with some stuff for leveling up
 

Are you kidding... Nope, you're not. How the...?

Apparently I downloaded a shorter (older?) version of the Guide at some point at some time. It's only 30 pages long and missing a food bit of crunch (Primordial Warlock, among others) as well as lore. Yet the cover of it and the current one on DriveThru bith took identical, both stating "A 5e Source Book"...

I'm baffled, but the topic is now cleared up. Thanks to all.
goes and prints out the correct version...
 

Salicus

Explorer
Are you kidding... Nope, you're not. How the...?

Apparently I downloaded a shorter (older?) version of the Guide at some point at some time. It's only 30 pages long and missing a food bit of crunch (Primordial Warlock, among others) as well as lore. Yet the cover of it and the current one on DriveThru bith took identical, both stating "A 5e Source Book"...

I'm baffled, but the topic is now cleared up. Thanks to all.
goes and prints out the correct version...
Yes that is the newer version. The old one did have a lot less of subclasses but the new version has one for every class. Glad I could help ;)
 

Tormyr

Adventurer
The original player's guide just had 5e versions of the 3.5 prestige classes/subclasses redone as 5e subclasses. I had wanted to make 5e subclasses for each class, but it took me a few years to come up with concepts that I was happy with for each class. The campaign guide has ideas on how to integrate characters with those subclasses into the campaign (where they might come from, who they might know, etc.).
 

emeraldbeacon

Adventurer
Yes that is the newer version. The old one did have a lot less of subclasses but the new version has one for every class. Glad I could help ;)
That makes me wonder, if one was to go back and add new, thematic subclass for the Artificer and/or Blood Hunter classes, what would they be? :unsure:

Artificers, with their science-based magic, could be an Arcane Researcher from an academic institution (Gabal's School, the Lyceum, or something else)? Grant proficiency or expertise in History and/or Arcana, allow Experimental Upcasting (with a possibility of failure and/or backlash)?

Blood Hunters could be tangentially related to either the Order of the Aquiline Cross? A sort of dark paladin, they channel their own blood as a source of power, for both offensive and defensive purposes. Perhaps they can use their own blood as a source of healing and protection for others?
 

Fuzzybear

Explorer
The original player's guide just had 5e versions of the 3.5 prestige classes/subclasses redone as 5e subclasses. I had wanted to make 5e subclasses for each class, but it took me a few years to come up with concepts that I was happy with for each class. The campaign guide has ideas on how to integrate characters with those subclasses into the campaign (where they might come from, who they might know, etc.).
Was this not updated in the Roll20 Player's Guide then? That would be an interesting addition that I'm missing it seems...
 


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