warlocs

[Raspen]

ok i have a 20lvl warloc that i brought into a epic lvl low magic campain (low magic only meening items) my guy keeps getting exposed to questioning do to the fact that i can use my Spellike abilitys over and over without limit.

what are your views on worlocks being over powered?

some of the things said to me is it takes a 9lvl slot for a wizard to use a 1st lvl spell over and over

and other casters cant keep casting greater invis over and over

and you can use your blast over and over agin doing 11d6!



my responces to them questions where.... if a lvl 20 sorcer whated to cast greater invis over and over he could do it 36times. and at lvl 20 maxing out on damage in one round at 66 seems very week to me.

am i wrong are warlocks overpowered and i just dont see it?

 

[I'm A Banana]

Wizards have a lot more versatility and power than a warlock does, able to benefit the entire party and accomplish much with a little preparation.

Warlocks are actually kind of weak, especially at higher levels. You can do your stuff at will, but the stuff you can do is hardly over-powering.

 

[Wik]

Yeah, I'm not too big a fan of 'em. I think they're tougher at lower levels, but as the game progresses, they're really nothing more than damage machines.

 

[Drowbane]

am i wrong are warlocks overpowered and i just dont see it?

The only thing Warlocks really have going for them is Stamina. And as you mentioned, a High level Sorc has enough Stamina to match... not to mention alot more firepower.

 

[Treebore]

Yeah, the Warlock PrC in the Warcraft RPG is powerful. Your Warlock is cool, but I wouldn't play him in a game where it could/would go epic. The Warcraft Warlock sucks at Epic, even at 44th level.

Since my DM and I have intensely studied the SRD Epic section and discussed it a good bit, I don't think my PC is going to be "sucky" anymore. His Warlock powers still aren't very good, but I have gotten some good ideas that my DM is considering from the Epic section over at the WOTC boards.

 

[Nonlethal Force]

As others have said, typically the Warlock follows the fighter in the power curve. Powerful at the beginning, still okay in the middle, outshined by the sheer effectiveness of a properly played caster in the end.

Having said that, realize that this largely depends on how many combats there are before a rest. If you are playing in a group that has 4 or more encounters before a rest each day, the warlock is going to be "back-up" for the casters in damage deal for one or two of those encounters but then they are going to be able to shine as the spellcasters start losing their higher level spells. If you are in a game with only 1-2 encounters before resting the warlock should almost always be minor to the spellcasters.

11d6 is nice, especially for a ranged touch attack. It should hit with regularity. But you compare that with the possible damage of an 8th or 9th level spell at caster level 20 (or epic) and you'll see that the 11d6 is more like the damage received from having made a save than from taking the full effect of the spell.

All in all, I think the warlock is playable as-is, doesn't need fixing, a bit on the weak side, exploitable in some circumstances, but a great ally when the party needs a rest but is being pursued by an equal enemy. It has its strengths.

Aside: With any character that uses a non-traditional (vancian?) style of magic use, it typically seems quite overpowered at the beginning. People said (and say) the same thing about psions and wilders. But a good DM should be able to find flaws that they can count on to challenge the character's bread and butter. This skill only comes with practice and time. As you play the warlock, your DM will get used to having you around and find your weaknesses. Then the other players will begin to see the balance and not just the overpoweredness that is often the first reaction. Part of the problem may be that you jumped in with a level 20. If you had built your character up from a level 1 to a level 20 from gameplay, your DM could have grown with you.

 

[Agent Oracle]

Thing is, this is a low-magic-item campaign, meaning that your warlock is pumping out, what, 11d6 damage / round?

Meanwhile, Mr. melee is using his crappy little +x / special magic item weapon. 4dy + whatever / round in damage.

Honestly, I can see how people would be concerned about a high-power non traditional spellcaster in a low-magic place.

The first time I had a player run a warlock, i was a trifle bit concerned, but I started them at 1st level, and watched and learned as he played, soon, i was adept at running warlock-countering enemies (though the medusa with levels in monk was probably more evil than it had to be)

Frankly, I think Low magic-item campaigns are unfairly weighted against Fighters / rogues / barbarians and other classes without spellcasting abilities. But that's the GM's problem. If my MG told me "low magic items" I'd go straight for the spellcasting classes too.

 

[frankthedm]

The warlock balance of power works reasonably for the standard set up wotc used for thier editions of D&D. Their unlimted use of thier abilities will look strong in games that don't use that standard or place higher premiums on magical effects that a warlock can use at will. A warlock is a class a DM running a lowish magic game should NOT allow, right up there with Vow of Poverty.

They are overall weaker than normal caster /blasters, but they are never crippled with thier resourses running low as all other casters. But when the other players can't always count on flying magic and back up scrolls and wands, Warlocks start to shine.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Actually, I forgot about the low magic item bit. If this is the case, then, yes, the Warolck might very well ruin the feel the DM is going for, since they are wands with unlimited charges. A DM who wants to keep close tabs on the items the party comes accross is going to see the Warlock as routing around that.

It's not too powerful, but it might not fit the feel your DM is going for, in which case I'd either discuss the low-magic-item policy, or just go with a Sorcerer and use the Warlock's flavor.

 

[Raspen]

some of the bigger issues i face is that i can Dim door so to say over and over making walking pointless.

i can greater dispell and with arcane mastery that makes me have an auto 30

i have a vest of resistance +5 cloak of chr +6 because of this two items and the dark ones luck ability + the feat Force of personality my saves are crazy high and the only thing that i have going for me

i have greater invis that is just bout permanit

so its not that i do alot of damage it more on the lines that i just cant be killed easy

and that is what they seem to not like