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<blockquote data-quote="Aura" data-source="post: 6829263" data-attributes="member: 6747658">Because armor is actually a set of discrete items (even though we almost universally account for it as a single item), the language used by the shopkeeper was appropriate to either of these two scenarios:(1) The player is presenting an armor set(2) The player is presenting an armor set, a mismatched pair of gauntlets and an attached ringTherefore, what the shopkeeper said is not a 'tip off' to scenario 2 in any real respect.Now, the DM has since said the interaction in the shop showed the shopkeeper acting a bit oddly in other respects, but it is impossible to tell if they actually rise to the level of being a 'tip off'. It's also worth noting we're dealing with his subjective memory here and not specifics. What we do know is the DM did not allow any sort of perception roll or similar mechanic to the player to notice that what he was selling was not what he was expecting to sell, even as he is (likely, we're not sure on this, as noted by Yardiff) likely actually handling the items. Further, he's asking to make an Int roll to assess the armor, which implies more than a complete disconnect from it.The players made a mistake in the previous scene. But the mistake in the shop was the DM's. I don't hold that against him in any real respect, he seems to be trying to run an entertaining game for his players and all that good jazz. I suspect he merely got a little excited over the possibilities going through his head and unintentionally made an error to see things went that direction. Errors of this nature happen all the time, and they are survivable -- but it doesn't mean they are not errors.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Aura, post: 6829263, member: 6747658"] Because armor is actually a set of discrete items (even though we almost universally account for it as a single item), the language used by the shopkeeper was appropriate to either of these two scenarios: (1) The player is presenting an armor set (2) The player is presenting an armor set, a mismatched pair of gauntlets and an attached ring Therefore, what the shopkeeper said is not a 'tip off' to scenario 2 in any real respect. Now, the DM has since said the interaction in the shop showed the shopkeeper acting a bit oddly in other respects, but it is impossible to tell if they actually rise to the level of being a 'tip off'. It's also worth noting we're dealing with his subjective memory here and not specifics. What we do know is the DM did not allow any sort of perception roll or similar mechanic to the player to notice that what he was selling was not what he was expecting to sell, even as he is (likely, we're not sure on this, as noted by Yardiff) likely actually handling the items. Further, he's asking to make an Int roll to assess the armor, which implies more than a complete disconnect from it. The players made a mistake in the previous scene. But the mistake in the shop was the DM's. I don't hold that against him in any real respect, he seems to be trying to run an entertaining game for his players and all that good jazz. I suspect he merely got a little excited over the possibilities going through his head and unintentionally made an error to see things went that direction. Errors of this nature happen all the time, and they are survivable -- but it doesn't mean they are not errors. [/QUOTE]

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