Nightcloak
First Post
What a wonderful group of ideas. These will be very useful.
Ways to make combats more interesting
Jondor_Battlehammer
First Post
Have big dumb ogre minion do something big and dumb, like getting mad if critted and bull rushing a PC into the wall. Of course there was a brazier next to the wall, and now both the PCs and the BBEG are cringing as the place catches fire. Not only could it make the fight more interesting, but it could also help the PCs as the bad guy takes a round or to to hit the flames with ice spells, so as not to lose his castle.
A lot is said about smart villians, but dumb moves also add to the story.
A lot is said about smart villians, but dumb moves also add to the story.
derbacher
Explorer
Amen! Play the critters as smart or dumb as the critters are supposed to be. Mindless undead zombie? Stumble straight at 'em. Hobgoblin hunting party? Disciplined tactics for military maneuvers. Evi9l Necromancer lich? Every option in the books and then some! Always have a back-up plan/escape route.
Mr_GrinReaper
First Post
LOL. That reminds me of something I sprung in a dungeon crawl. Can you say giant spider anyone. The PC's weren't exactally smart about it though. They cast light on his eyes...
He was blinded and charged them, smashing them against the wall, and almost killing them, fortunately our archer managed to get him before he did any more damage.
Not to mention he left a huge pool of acid all over. (Stomach Acid
)
~
GrinReaper
"The Counterattack is slowing down"
He was blinded and charged them, smashing them against the wall, and almost killing them, fortunately our archer managed to get him before he did any more damage.
Not to mention he left a huge pool of acid all over. (Stomach Acid
)~
GrinReaper
"The Counterattack is slowing down"
XCorvis
First Post
I think I've used most of the suggestions and converted them into the paragraph form I started with. I'm thinking of posting the complete list in the regular EN World forum, with credit going to everyone involved (as a group, not by individual item).
Remember the Consequences - This can apply to other circumstances, but the most common situation is when the PCs step outside the bounds of the law during the course of a fight. They may end up killing some folks in a "harmless" tavern brawl, or attacking someone who isn't actually an enemy. If you come down hard on the players after these situations (like with a trial or jail time) they will be more reserved in the future. The fight will be more difficult (and hopefully interesting) if the PCs are trying to take their opponents alive or avoid certain tactics.
Do More Than Just Hit Things - Most creatures are smart enough to try to gain a tactical advantage in combat. Have them trip PCs to make them easier to hit and sunder their weapons. Grappling is good when monsters are having a hard time hitting the PCs. Monsters also have some self-preservation instincts - have them run to safety, drink a potion of healing and return to combat.
Add Color Commentary - Describe the action with more detail: "The hobgoblin's longsword swings in low but deflects off your greaves." Have the monsters comment on the fighting and engage in witty (or not so witty) banter with the PCs. The ogre who shouts "Thag smash you like he smash his mother" is far more memorable than the one who says nothing.
Keep Secrets - Don't tell the players things their characters wouldn't know. If they need to know what spell is being cast, (and there aren't obvious effects) they should roll spellcraft. Hit points are another secret. Use descriptive terms to describe the enemies wounds rather than numbers - "the orc is barely standing," or "he shruggs of the scratch you gave him." Keep the players guessing as to how long the opponent will last.
Give the Fight a Goal - Sometimes you're not fighting to simply kill your opponents but instead are just trying to accomplish a goal. A free-for-all race is a good example of this, with the PCs fighting their opponents to try to slow them down, rather than kill them. Another is the PCs attempting to disrupt a ritual - the PCs need to attack the enemies in the ritual, but the defenders are delaying the PCs, who are running out of time...
Dumb Enemies Fight Dumb - If smart enemies should fight smart, the reverse should be true. That big dumb ogre or hulking construct isn't going to use a lot of strategy - it's going to walk up to PCs and hit them. The PCs should have a chance to take advantage of it. This might not seem more interesting at first, but it is better for the players because they have a chance to out-think their enemies and use feats, abilities and skills to their advantage.
Accidents Happen - You might already have a house rule about critical fumbles, but you can use them more creatively than "you drop your weapon" or "the orc hits himself with his axe." When that big dumb ogre rolls a 1, he knocks over a braizer and it starts a tapestry on fire, creating a hazard for everyone.
Use the Enviornment - Have your monsters take advantage of the terrain and objects in the room. Fight with your back to a small chasm or wall to avoid some flanking. Jump on that table to gain a height advantage, or flip it and use it for cover. Something as simple as closing a door can have major implications on combat.
Alternate Spells - If you're sick of just having spellcasters use fireball and lighting bolt over and over again, try a different selection of spells - Wall spells, Rock to Mud, Slow, Haste, illusions and many other spells can all be used to make the PCs make less than optimal choices on the battlefield without dealing direct damage. You can also take a rarely used spell and design a fight where it becomes very potent, such as PCs fighting on a greased stairway.
Advance the Story - Roleplaying is often referred to as Collaborative Storytelling. Combat is no different than any other part of the game. NPCs don't stop "acting" just because they're fighting. Have the villian drop a plot point in the middle of combat - he's stressed out and not thinking about what he's saying. Maybe that big dumb ogre is actually a pyromaniac and knocked that braizer over on purpose, and now the BBEG has to get that fight put out while simultaneously fighting the PCs.
Remember the Consequences - This can apply to other circumstances, but the most common situation is when the PCs step outside the bounds of the law during the course of a fight. They may end up killing some folks in a "harmless" tavern brawl, or attacking someone who isn't actually an enemy. If you come down hard on the players after these situations (like with a trial or jail time) they will be more reserved in the future. The fight will be more difficult (and hopefully interesting) if the PCs are trying to take their opponents alive or avoid certain tactics.
Do More Than Just Hit Things - Most creatures are smart enough to try to gain a tactical advantage in combat. Have them trip PCs to make them easier to hit and sunder their weapons. Grappling is good when monsters are having a hard time hitting the PCs. Monsters also have some self-preservation instincts - have them run to safety, drink a potion of healing and return to combat.
Add Color Commentary - Describe the action with more detail: "The hobgoblin's longsword swings in low but deflects off your greaves." Have the monsters comment on the fighting and engage in witty (or not so witty) banter with the PCs. The ogre who shouts "Thag smash you like he smash his mother" is far more memorable than the one who says nothing.
Keep Secrets - Don't tell the players things their characters wouldn't know. If they need to know what spell is being cast, (and there aren't obvious effects) they should roll spellcraft. Hit points are another secret. Use descriptive terms to describe the enemies wounds rather than numbers - "the orc is barely standing," or "he shruggs of the scratch you gave him." Keep the players guessing as to how long the opponent will last.
Give the Fight a Goal - Sometimes you're not fighting to simply kill your opponents but instead are just trying to accomplish a goal. A free-for-all race is a good example of this, with the PCs fighting their opponents to try to slow them down, rather than kill them. Another is the PCs attempting to disrupt a ritual - the PCs need to attack the enemies in the ritual, but the defenders are delaying the PCs, who are running out of time...
Dumb Enemies Fight Dumb - If smart enemies should fight smart, the reverse should be true. That big dumb ogre or hulking construct isn't going to use a lot of strategy - it's going to walk up to PCs and hit them. The PCs should have a chance to take advantage of it. This might not seem more interesting at first, but it is better for the players because they have a chance to out-think their enemies and use feats, abilities and skills to their advantage.
Accidents Happen - You might already have a house rule about critical fumbles, but you can use them more creatively than "you drop your weapon" or "the orc hits himself with his axe." When that big dumb ogre rolls a 1, he knocks over a braizer and it starts a tapestry on fire, creating a hazard for everyone.
Use the Enviornment - Have your monsters take advantage of the terrain and objects in the room. Fight with your back to a small chasm or wall to avoid some flanking. Jump on that table to gain a height advantage, or flip it and use it for cover. Something as simple as closing a door can have major implications on combat.
Alternate Spells - If you're sick of just having spellcasters use fireball and lighting bolt over and over again, try a different selection of spells - Wall spells, Rock to Mud, Slow, Haste, illusions and many other spells can all be used to make the PCs make less than optimal choices on the battlefield without dealing direct damage. You can also take a rarely used spell and design a fight where it becomes very potent, such as PCs fighting on a greased stairway.
Advance the Story - Roleplaying is often referred to as Collaborative Storytelling. Combat is no different than any other part of the game. NPCs don't stop "acting" just because they're fighting. Have the villian drop a plot point in the middle of combat - he's stressed out and not thinking about what he's saying. Maybe that big dumb ogre is actually a pyromaniac and knocked that braizer over on purpose, and now the BBEG has to get that fight put out while simultaneously fighting the PCs.
Blade of Desecration
First Post
YOU BASTARD, VINCE TOLD ME TO CAST LIGHT ON IT'S FRIGGING EYES, IT WAS 3 O'CLOCK IN THE MORNING, WHAT THE HELL DID YOU EXPECT ME TO DO, FIGHT SMART???Mr_GrinReaper said:LOL. That reminds me of something I sprung in a dungeon crawl. Can you say giant spider anyone. The PC's weren't exactally smart about it though. They cast light on his eyes...
He was blinded and charged them, smashing them against the wall, and almost killing them, fortunately our archer managed to get him before he did any more damage.
Not to mention he left a huge pool of acid all over. (Stomach Acid
~
GrinReaper
"The Counterattack is slowing down"
Look, now I'm crying, you heartless bastard. Blade of Desecration
First Post
Anything involving pirate ninjas riding half-fiend dinosaurs. Now THAT'S interesting.
Reminds me of the time when Mr. Grin Reaper's swashbuckler had the fight with the bugbear bandit king. We had an entire banter session between them during the fight.XCorvis said:
Last edited:
Mr_GrinReaper
First Post
Yeah, that was called to my mind when I read the witty repartee section XD
That was definitly cool, but I felt sorry for the others... lol had to sit and watch me massacre him. (Well, not exactally)
Well, The spider thing was funny all the same.
~/ ^^
That was definitly cool, but I felt sorry for the others... lol had to sit and watch me massacre him. (Well, not exactally)
Well, The spider thing was funny all the same.
~/ ^^
Blade of Desecration
First Post
Dude, you did not massacre him. If I recall, you were almost dead when he finally surrendered, and were only kept alive by your extra healing potion.Mr_GrinReaper said:Yeah, that was called to my mind when I read the witty repartee section XD
That was definitly cool, but I felt sorry for the others... lol had to sit and watch me massacre him. (Well, not exactally)
Well, The spider thing was funny all the same.
~/ ^^
Nightcloak
First Post
This is some really great advice in this thread. I tried some of it in my last game and it worked wonderfully.
Great Job!
One idea to add that I have used:
Reach Weapons: Creatures with reach weapons get an AoO when players move in on them. This makes a fighter with a readied action capable of hitting twice. Give to ogres for extra fun.
Great Job!
One idea to add that I have used:
Reach Weapons: Creatures with reach weapons get an AoO when players move in on them. This makes a fighter with a readied action capable of hitting twice. Give to ogres for extra fun.
