Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 9116966" data-attributes="member: 22779">Not quite.&nbsp; The underlying argument is that the source inspiration - pulp fiction - is not really a good reflection of how D&amp;D actually works.&nbsp; D&amp;D has never done pulp heroes.&nbsp; Pulp heroes are never &quot;farm boys just off the turnip truck&quot;.&nbsp; That's what you get in things like Tolkien and later fantasy to a large degree.&nbsp; (although there are earlier examples of course)&nbsp; The &quot;zero to hero&quot; is the opposite of Pulp heroes.&nbsp; And it's that complete misunderstanding of what pulp actually means that drives so many of the disagreements about what D&amp;D should be doing.Ahh, my bad.&nbsp; I got Phoenix mixed up with Tower.&nbsp; I think it's because I read Tower first, so, it's always the &quot;first&quot; Conan story in my head.&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue&nbsp; &nbsp; :p"&nbsp; data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" />&nbsp; You are, of course, right.But, again, while I might have gotten my publication dates wrong, the basic point remains.&nbsp; At no point is Conan a 1st level character.&nbsp; No pulp hero is ever a 1st level character.&nbsp; That's not something that comes from pulps.&nbsp; That comes from epic fantasy, really.&nbsp; Tolkien, Lloyd Alexander.&nbsp; C. S. Lewis where the heroes are literal children when the story starts.&nbsp; That's the inspiration for leveling in D&amp;D.&nbsp; But everyone wants to connect OSR to Pulp fantasy because Epic fantasy doesn't fit with their interpretation of what D&amp;D is &quot;supposed&quot; to be.&nbsp; You want pulp fantasy?&nbsp; Try Savage Worlds.&nbsp; THAT'S pulp.&nbsp; D&amp;D?&nbsp; D&amp;D has never been Pulp fantasy.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 9116966, member: 22779"] Not quite. The underlying argument is that the source inspiration - pulp fiction - is not really a good reflection of how D&D actually works. D&D has never done pulp heroes. Pulp heroes are never "farm boys just off the turnip truck". That's what you get in things like Tolkien and later fantasy to a large degree. (although there are earlier examples of course) The "zero to hero" is the opposite of Pulp heroes. And it's that complete misunderstanding of what pulp actually means that drives so many of the disagreements about what D&D should be doing. Ahh, my bad. I got Phoenix mixed up with Tower. I think it's because I read Tower first, so, it's always the "first" Conan story in my head. :p You are, of course, right. But, again, while I might have gotten my publication dates wrong, the basic point remains. At no point is Conan a 1st level character. No pulp hero is ever a 1st level character. That's not something that comes from pulps. That comes from epic fantasy, really. Tolkien, Lloyd Alexander. C. S. Lewis where the heroes are literal children when the story starts. That's the inspiration for leveling in D&D. But everyone wants to connect OSR to Pulp fantasy because Epic fantasy doesn't fit with their interpretation of what D&D is "supposed" to be. You want pulp fantasy? Try Savage Worlds. THAT'S pulp. D&D? D&D has never been Pulp fantasy. [/QUOTE]

Verification