What d20 Purchases to you Regret?

[Gothmog]

Books I regret buying:

Epic Level Handbook- BLAH. Complete waste of time.
FRCS- I have no idea why I got this. I hate the Realms. I think I got it because someone told me it reminded them of the original gray box Realms. HA!
Psionics Handbook- very poorly executed, and very boring. I'm not a big psionics fan, but this book left me wondering why bother?
City of the Spider Queen- just a meatgrinder dungeonhack full of drow. Pretty book though.
Magic of Faerun- completely broken munchkin dream.
WotC Splatbooks- wow, these are pretty much useless. The basic ideas are so out there I can't ever see using them.
Rituals & Relics- some interesting ideas, really shoddy mechanics.
Gamma World PH- wow, I had no idea GW could be made so boring. And the nanotech is stupid.
Arcana Unearthed- after all the hype, I figured it would be really good. After I read it, I can't see using a single thing out of that book. The mechanics seemed ok, its just a style of play I have absolutely no interest in.
Draconomicon- wow, I didn't know dragons could be made so boring and predictable. I know lots of folks love it, but for me it codified too much about dragons, and didn't expand on them as much as define them.

Books I LOVE:
3.5 books
Fiend Folio
Book of Vile Darkness- about 80% of the stuff is great stuff for villians
Midnight and all its sourcebooks- 'nuff said.
Book of the Righteous- great book full of wonderful campaign and background ideas.
Liber Bestarius
Penumbra Fantasy Bestiary
Legions of Hell and Armies of the Abyss- can't wait for Book of Fiends!
Skull & Bones
Testament
Heck, anything Green Ronin makes
Freeport stuff- pretty much everything
FFG Legends & Lairs series- all of it!
Mongoose Quintessential line- has some mechanics issues, but MUCH better ideas than the other classbooks out there. I have gotten lots of use out of them, and never found them to be as game-breaking as the WotC stuff.
Classic Play Book of Dragons- what the Draconomicon should have been
Dynasties & Demagogues and Crime & Punishment- great stuff for the campaign world to help it make logical sense
MMS:WE- the BEST medieval source for a campaign world I have yet seen.
Fields of Blood
Darwin's World 2nd edition- the best post-apocalyptic setting out there

 

[Derulbaskul]

(snip) I won't ask people to forgive my ire here. I get enough of it else where. So what I will say is grow up people. If you can design better books in the time alotted AND STILL manage a personal life, then do so. Step up and put your money where your mouth is. My point is S&SS might have ups and down but what REALLY sickens me is the amount of bashing I see on mechanics just because people THINK they can do better. I congradulate the freelancers, the authors and the developers, not just of WW, S&SS and it affiliates but ALL d20 products who put their necks out there than try some time. Until I see that from others, I just say keep quiet.

Nightfall,

That's the way I feel about people who contribute and distribute free material through fansites etc.... However, as soon as a price tag goes on a book then the publisher is saying, "This has value therefore I am going to charge you." If the purchaser then discovers that the value is limited because of quality issues (ideas, execution/mechanics, general editing) then that becomes a legitimate issue.

Also, consider this: S&SS has a track record of producing really, really broken stuff. I mean, we're not talking the unadulterated crap level of FFE, but we are talking a really poor reputation for broken mechanics etc.... However, they're ideas are often really, really good. What they need to do is look at threads like this and go, "yes, we can do better than that". They're not alone, of course. Even WotC had a fairly disastrous run with the softcover splatbooks, Mongoose and AEG have also had fairly problematic products.

Anyway, this is not a rant about prices: I value everything against how much I pay for a movie. A movie entertains me for about two hours. I pay AUD13 for that which is AUD6.50 per hour so provided my use of the book "costs" me about half that or less I am happy. However, just as I hate seeing a bad movie irrespective of the cost, I also hate wasting item reading poor material.

Back on-topic, I regret purchasing the first few products by the publishers mentioned above and simply do not do so any more. I think I have all the WotC products and I really only regret my purchase of eTools (Hero Builder's Guidebook has more utility that this), although my disappointment with MMII has become a tangible thing (although Fiend Folio is so good, IMO, that I think I've forgiven WotC). D&DG was also basically terrible: deities don't have stats, IMO, but if they did then they would be based on the Epic Level Handbook.

Although this may be an heretical POV, I also regret my AU purchases. While it's all very interesting, the Diamond Throne world lacks that "certain something" (actually, I would have preferred something based on Monte's Ptolus articles), I really miss alignment and I would have preferred that it used 3.5E mechanics except for the revised magic system to increase its ease of use. Looking back, I would have preferred that it required the 3.5E PHB to use and the extra space used to provide a system that replaced alignment, along the lines of The Riddle of Steel's spiritual attributes or Exalted's traits (although I am not sure what they are called... but they're things like a Compassion rating etc...). Actually, the extra space could also have been used to better describe how runes work, an issue that seems to crop up with some frequency on messageboards.

 

[Crothian]

Anyone thought of trying to organize a trade? One person's useless d20 books are another person's treasure. I think all this regret for having certain books can turn into someone's boon.

 

[PJ Mason]

Well to address the Scarred lands issue someone brought up: for my own part I happened to really like the original Scarred Lands gaz..it was one of those cool bare bones products that gave lots of ideas for me to flesh out and the value for the $ was great. It was like the original Greyhawk folio in spirit. When I bought the hardcover, I found out I didn't care for the way SSS had fleshed out the setting in pretty much any way, shape, or form :shug:

I also don't like the typical WW "need 3 more books of ours to use the book you just bought" tactic, which is also a problem w/ Ravenloft. BIG pet peeve of mine.

Well. You said what i wanted to say, but did it much better. Thanks.

 

[Pants]

Though I am pleased with the 'Creature Collection I' book that I have. Why? Because it's interesting and not due for a 3.5 upgrade any time soon! LoL

That's because it's already been 3.5-ified.

Books I regret purchasing:
Deities and Demigods by WotC: I think back and I remember being really excited about this book, but I can't really remember why. I have never used this book... ever.
Song and Silence/Sword and Fist by WotC: The only two splatbooks that I consider truly abysmal. Waste of my money, both of them.
Psionics Handbook by WotC: I really liked this book. Very high quality stuff in here, great production values, however there are three things that I have against it. 1) I'll probably never run psionics, 2) the rules implement was wonky (psions sucked), and 3) Psionics felt just like magic, only with power points. Eh.
Creature Collection 1 by SSS: Nice ideas, poor implementation.
Ravenloft Campaign Setting by SSS: I'll probably never run a Ravenloft game ever. I liked the sound of the setting, but then I bought the book and read about...
Path of the Sword by FFG: Just sort of a boring book. Some of the ideas were cool, but not enough...
Demons and Devils by FFE: Urgh. Bad book make brain hurt. BAD BOOK. Hulk smash! Hulk sell at garage sale for small amount of money. Hulk placated...
E-Tools: God... I wanted a program that would make quick and easy NPC's, instead I got E-Tools... Yay, go me.

Books I am SUPER HAPPY I purchased:
Fiend Folio by WotC
3.5 Core Books by WotC
Manual of the Planes by WotC
Book of Vile Darkness and Book of Exalted Deeds by WotC

As you can see, all of my favorite purchases are WotC purchases. I haven't had very much luck with 3rd party stuff. Although CC2 is nice...

 

[Sir Whiskers]

Nightfall,

However, as soon as a price tag goes on a book then the publisher is saying, "This has value therefore I am going to charge you."

I think is was Asimov who said that authors are the most egotistical people in the world, because they believe others will pay good money just to read what the author has to say.

Then again, if people really do pay money for what you say, are you still being egotistical?

 

[PJ Mason]

Wow! It seems as if everyone who's mentioned "The Scarred Lands" has put in into their "regret" list. Is it really THAT bad? If so, why'd you dudes buy it in the first place? Not to harp on any of you, but I generally page through books prior to buying them to make sure it's something that I won't regret buying later on in life.

I bought the gazeteer and thought it was great. I had run 1 campaign and was in the middle of another when the other books started coming out and didn't jibe with my stuff. I got 6 of the books in the space of 2 weeks (2 were gifts), because i was sure that i would love them......i didn't. got rid of most of them. Like every WW product i've ever used or seen, they made a great read but their mechanics (whether D20 or whatever) were always irratating and too many of their books would be sloppy. I thought S&S stuff would be different. Turns out...not so much. I won't ask for forgiveness for my opinion either.

 

[Remathilis]

I've FORCED myself to use every dang book I've bought, but some have been dust-gatherers for some time.

Rarely-Used: Not worth it despite the costs
Diablo II - Bought it for the monsters and Item Generator. Never used it once.
Enemies & Allies - Bought during my "must own everything WotC" phase. Used very sparingly.
Decipher LotR game. Got it at half off, but no one is ever gonna play it.
Star Wars original. Got it at $10.00. THe one time I thought I'd use it, I found out the group was using the revised. Ugh.
Creature Collection I & II. $6.00 Each. Never used.

Occasionally used: Served its purpose, now collects dust.
Honorary mention to: Psionics Handbook, Players Handbook, DMG, Monster Manual, and DM Screen (all original/3.0 versions.) Thank you friends. You may rest now.
Deities and Demi-gods: Nice reference, but too "stat" oriented and not "priest" oriented.
Return to Temple of Elemental Evil: Got half-way through before it plunked out, never have the energy to try it again.
D&D Gazetteer: Didn't want to sink the cash into LGG just for some general background info on RtToEE, but kinda useless now.
Hero-Builder's Guidebook: I like the alignment, backgound and name sections to this day, but the class/race combos are for pure newbies.

Glad I didn't buy (things I thought about, but gleefully avoided)
Ravenloft, et all: The nostaliga kick wasn't worth the price of admission.
Kalamar: Great setting, but very costly to get into.
Assassin's Handbook: Poorly thought out base class.
Necromancers College (or something like that) See above.
Quintisental Classes and Races: The WotC books were/are good enough for me, esp the races of/complete lines coming out.
Relics and Rituals: That spell does WHAT?
Arcana Unearthed: I like the concepts and some classes, but the conversion needed to D&D 3.5 is more work than its worth.

 

[Pants]

I'm kinda surprised by how much Scarred Lands stuff is getting kicked around. I always hear how great everyone thinks it is. Learn something new everyday...

 

[talien]

Heehee!

I'm sure this thread will hurt more feelings that just yours, Nighty!

Gotta have thick skin to be a designer/hardcore fanboy in this internet age of ours.

I'm skimming through the list, thinking, "Oh please don't be one of my titles, please don't be one of my titles, pleasedon'tbe...ah crap."

And there it is!

Oh well. Live and learn and hope for a good layout designer/editor for the final product.