D&D 4E What do you think of the 4E background to demons & devils?

[Wormwood]

I see it as change for the sake of change. The sheep will love it though.

I'm not sure which I prefer, being called a 'chump' or a 'sheep'.

 

[Treebore]

The 4E demons & devil's thread seems to have devolved into calling the other side wrong for liking or disliking the background to devils & demons in 4E as revealed in the most recent Design & Development article.

So, let's put it to a vote. What do you think of division between devils & demons revealed in the article?

As far as their roles go, I like it, since I have been using Demons and Devils that way ever since I started DMing. As for Asmodeous and where his plane is, I am fine with it too, because it is darn close to how I have been doing it as well.

So I am pleased with this.

 

[Lonely Tylenol]

I'm not well-represented by these options. I voted neutral. I like it. I have no qualms about changing the core setting. I happen to like the Great Wheel and the Greyhawk setting, and feel that I shall have zero trouble playing in that setting with the new rule set. I don't know whether I'll use the new cosmology at all, but don't care that it's in the implied setting. I might end up just running Pathfinder adventures for the next ten years anyway, which would make the point somewhat moot, since that setting is likely to develop its own unique cosmology.

 

[Lonely Tylenol]

I like it.

But then I probably would have liked any replacement of the Great Wheel. I've got books that detail the Great Wheel already (3.0 MotP, 3.5 DMG, was it in the 3.0 DMG too? And let's not even get started on the ton of 2.0 books that were printed on the subject). Why do I need recycled fluff? If I want to use that cosmology in my campaign, I've already got all the material I need to do so.

Exactly the way I feel about it. If I want to use the Great Wheel, I can do that without opening a book. I've been playing in the Great Wheel since first edition. That alone proves that it's not tied into any particular set of rules.

 

[Mercule]

Love it. Better matches my homebrew.

I love that demons no longer care about souls, which was something I never really understood, other than tradition. I very, very, very much hope that means we won't be seeing demons and devils "evolve" through the different types any longer. Promotions and accumulation of power (e.g. Orcus and other lords) make sense, but not radically changing forms in nice, even increments -- especially when the new form has a proscribed role that probably differs radically from that of the prior form.

 

[Nifft]

I voted in the middle.

But really, what I mean is: my homebrew has extensive changes to the fluff regarding demons & devils, and I think I can make 4e's versions work for me by a similarly extensive set of changes.

In other words, they sound no worse than they are now, and I think I can make them work for me about as easily.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Shade]

Never mind.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Honestly, I think the change is extremely positive, and those claiming it's "pointless" border on trolling nonsense, because the point is extremely clear - to differentiate Devils and Demons and give them real purposes and roles in the game world (haha even the most evil of beings have roles now eh?).

The idea of separating out destructive, rampaging demons, and more cerebrals, manipulative devils seems like an absolutely stellar one to me, and I'm really confused as to why anyone would think it was "pointless" (disliking it because it's a cosmology change, otoh, seems reasonable enough).

I see it as change for the sake of change. The sheep will love it though.

There's something intensely hilarious about someone with an Aragorn avatar and a ludicrous fancy-boy fantasy name calling people sheep. I can't but read it in "Comic-Book Guy" voice, I guess that's what it is

 

[MoogleEmpMog]

A much more useful and easy to grasp distinction that at once better exemplifies the alignments in question and pushes the meaningless alignment-based distinctions attached to the fiends into the background.

 

[Wormwood]

I can't but read it in "Comic-Book Guy" voice, I guess that's what it is

Worst. Cosmology. Ever.