D&D 5E What do you want in a published adventure? / Adventure design best practices?

[Quickleaf]

More or less. The only thing I'd add would be the page number in the MM.

If two or more of the appearances happen to be on the same two-page spread then one could point to the other, where the stat block is (assuming they're exactly the same). Otherwise, 4 times it is.

The stat block has to go somewhere, no matter how big or elaborate it is. Put it in the creature's room description.

One thing I saw in Out of the Abyss was notation like "4 myconids", with the bolded text referencing a monster stat block that either appeared in the MM or in the monstrous appendix of that book. Presumably this is done to save space and make room for new, interesting stuff in the pages of the adventure. It sounds like you're strongly down-voting that approach in favor of the AD&D ease-of-use approach, right?

That's messier. Anything that's based permanently in that room e.g. a guardian statue gets its stat block there. Otherwise, this is one case where just saying what's in the room when and pointing to the stat blocks for their lairs makes sense. It might look something like:

AREA 11 - MAIN TEMPLE ROOM <boxed description goes here>

OCCUPANTS - these vary as shown below:

Always present: Guardian Statue (1), HP 95, AC 17, <etc. - full stat block>
Present within one hour of any sunrise or sunset: Any surviving Clerics from area 13 (page 8), HP 29,27,31,34; AC 13 or 16
Present within one hour either side of noon: Any surviving acolytes from area 28 (page 15), HP 7 each; AC 12
Present during any ceremony (see development track page 2 for when these occur): all of the above plus Temple Master from area 31 (page 16), HP 78; AC 15 or 22
Present 30% of the time when no others are present: 1-3 Giant Rats from area 9 (page 6), HP 4 each; AC 12 - note that these will flee to area 9 on noticing anything other than a Giant Rat enter this area.

Howzat?

Yes, that's similar to what I was thinking.

A follow-up question: Let's say there are developments – reactions the monsters might take to the party of intruders, such as sending reinforcements (or sacrificial propitiations) to the MAIN TEMPLE ROOM. Would you want those developments notated under each room in which they occur, or in a separate "Developments" section?

Part of what I'm driving at is that – at a certain point – you risk bloating a single area description with stuff the DM may or may not need. I'm trying to hone in on what that ambiguous line looks like.

 

[fjw70]

I prefer the adventures to reduce m prep time as much as possible. As a compromise between having stat blocks in the adventure and not is to have PDF reference sheets for each room with stats blocks, traps, treasure, etc. Maybe this could be a DMs Guild supplement for each adventure. It could include more detailed maps as well and eliminate the background story and art work.

 

[Staccat0]

Why does an adventure need a linear path?

Ideally a good adventure never plays the same way twice, mostly because it's possible for a different approach to be taken by the party each time you run it.

A fine old-time example of this is the dungeon part of L1 Secret of Bone Hill. There's multiple ways to enter the castle/dungeon complex, multiple ways to go once inside including several closeable loops, and no guarantee for the DM what order things will be found/encountered in. Great design!

The same can be said of Dark Tower, a Judges Guild module that while being big for an adventure is still way too small to ever be considered a campaign settiing.

B10 Night's Dark Terror is one module that's closer to being its own little setting than just a single adventure, and IMO suffers for it.

Lanefan

Yeah, I think there needs to be a distinction between a linear path and a critical path. All good adventures probably have a critical path. Linear is just a matter of taste.

 

[trinculolives]

I'm sort of torn on this. I prefer no box text as it allows the DM to engage the players more intimately when using his/her own descriptions. As you said, players tend to check out when reading directly from the module. But I can appreciate some author's amazing descriptions if they're exceptional - some of Gygax's room descriptions were awesome, for example, and gave me a broader vocabulary to use when describing areas/encounters.

If I disengage when a DM starts reading it's generally because they're adopting a mono-tone voice involving little or no emphasis. I think being able to read a descriptive passage in such a way that it doesn't sound as though you are reading a passage is important, and is something I'm careful to do when I DM.

My current DM is especially droning. If the DM sounds bored reading boxed text, it naturally follows that the players will feel bored.

 

[steeldragons]

@Lanefan @steeldragons So, if I were taking the Oni (ogre mage), what would its abbreviated stats look like? Something like this?

Oni: Large giant; AC 16; HP 110; Saves Str +4, Dex +3, Con +6, Int +2, Wis +4, Cha +5; #Att 2 glaive, +7 (10 ft or 5 ft in Medium size), 2d10+4 slashing (or 1d10+4 in Medium size); senses 14 (darkvision 60 ft); change shape, magic weapons, regeneration (10); innate spells (at will – darkness, invisibility, 1/day –charm person, cone of cold, gaseous form, sleep; CR 7 (2,900 XP); Monster Manual.

Sure. That looks good. It's a lot, but some monsters are a lot. I might recommend combining the attack stats by size, to save a little space...

...#AT 2 glaive, +7, 10', 2d10+4 slashing (if Medium sized: +7, 5', 1d10+4 slashing)

I don't think it was universal,but I kind of recall spells and innate spell abilities being called "out" and listed separately/"under" the stats stuff. Now, whether "saves space" (definitely not line count) or simply changes layout/makes viewing/using the magic abilities easier for the reader, I'm not sure.

Oni: Large giant; AC 16; HP 110; Saves Str +4, Dex +3, Con +6, Int +2, Wis +4, Cha +5; #Att 2 glaive, +7 (10 ft or 5 ft in Medium size), 2d10+4 slashing (or 1d10+4 in Medium size); senses 14 (darkvision 60 ft); change shape, magic weapons, regeneration (10), innate spells:

At will: darkness invisibility
1/day: charm person, sleep, gaseous form, cone of cold​

CR 7 (2,900 XP); Monster Manual, p. ??.

Or something like that...maybe?

And then if an Oni appears elsewhere in the adventure 4 times, you repeat that abbreviated stat block each of those 4 times?

Well, preferably, you could use a reference to the original page, as Lanefan suggested, ideally if they're in the same spread. I personally, wouldn't mind referencing the original page number if there are several of the same creature...but then you're defeating the purpose of "ease of use/having it there in front of you on the page you need it." Obviously, if there is a difference/change in the creature (beyond just hit points), if it's wearing different armor or using a magical two-handed sword with special abilities instead of a glaive or whatever, then it gets its own block again. But, I suppose, if it appears four times in four different spreads, then yeah...kinda stuck/you should print it again.

What about much more complex monsters? Things like Archmages or Beholders?

As Lanefan notes, complex monsters are complex. Listing out lots of spells, even just "suggested prepared" or however it will be notated (and what's in spellbooks! Don't forget you need to list what's IN magic-using encounters spellbooks. Even if you just go simple and say "...in addition to their prepared spells listed, the Archmage's book contains your choice of additional spells from the Wizard spell list: 5 1st level, 3 2nd level..." etc... ) or multiple special abilities (for a beholder), Lair or Legendary Actions, etc... is going to take up room. There's no avoiding that.

What about rooms where who is in the room changes significantly based on different times of day, ceremonial circumstances, etc?

I'd basically go with Lanefan's suggestion here. Seems reasonable without taking up a ton of space.

It might look something like:

AREA 11 - MAIN TEMPLE ROOM <boxed description goes here>

OCCUPANTS - these vary as shown below:

Always present: Guardian Statue (1), HP 95, AC 17, <etc. - full stat block>
Present within one hour of any sunrise or sunset: Any surviving Clerics from area 13 (page 8), HP 29,27,31,34; AC 13 or 16
Present within one hour either side of noon: Any surviving acolytes from area 28 (page 15), HP 7 each; AC 12
Present during any ceremony (see development track page 2 for when these occur): all of the above plus Temple Master from area 31 (page 16), HP 78; AC 15 or 22
Present 30% of the time when no others are present: 1-3 Giant Rats from area 9 (page 6), HP 4 each; AC 12 - note that these will flee to area 9 on noticing anything other than a Giant Rat enter this area.

Howzat?

Zat's just fine, I think.

One thing I saw in Out of the Abyss was notation like "4 myconids", with the bolded text referencing a monster stat block that either appeared in the MM or in the monstrous appendix of that book. Presumably this is done to save space and make room for new, interesting stuff in the pages of the adventure. It sounds like you're strongly down-voting that approach in favor of the AD&D ease-of-use approach, right?

Oh gods, yes!

A follow-up question: Let's say there are developments – reactions the monsters might take to the party of intruders, such as sending reinforcements (or sacrificial propitiations) to the MAIN TEMPLE ROOM. Would you want those developments notated under each room in which they occur, or in a separate "Developments" section?

Ummm...I would think just a separate paragraph would suffice without needing an entirely new section.

"If the alarm has been raised, 5 of the guards (HP X,Y,Z,W,Q, AC: B) from the barracks in Area 20 will also be found in the Main Temple Room with 2 outside the doors, 1 inside and 2 flanking the alter. "

No, "Development" banner or anything. Just a kind of afterthought/last detail.

Part of what I'm driving at is that – at a certain point – you risk bloating a single area description with stuff the DM may or may not need. I'm trying to hone in on what that ambiguous line looks like.

You do indeed. Which is why we are so fortunate to have talented and conscientious adventure designers to pay attention to where that line may be and make sure that doesn't happen.

But saying "this is getting to be too much, so I'll shunt all of this other stuff, from EVERY room, and put it elsewhere in its own section" doesn't really solve the problem, does it? It's still page count. It's still material -which now the DM must be flipping back and forth with to check and incorporate.

I will admit, I don't generally write up very detailed adventures. Few stats, the general idea and premise, who the villains are gonna be and few environmental factors, and I just go/wing it. I will also admit I have not run a single printed/published adventure later than 1e. But I'mma gonna offer some advice anyway... and this goes back to the dreaded "cross the Line of Too Much [in a single area]"

It seems to me useful to remember that, like most of the rest of all things D&D, the adventure module is a generalized abstraction.

What I mean is, you don't have to incorporate every eventuality into every room/space. A monster can be here...if there is some useful story/adventure reason they would be elsewhere. Then mention that. Somewhat obviously, then, this monster can conceivably be encountered anywhere between those two places at whatever given times (if they have set times to be in either position). A generalized/major change in the many or most inhabitants' locations/behavior of an entire place -a fortress that has raised the alarm since the party entered and knows it's under attack/has intruders now, for example- can be handled by describing what happens all at once -I would say "up front" in the general background info before the adventure gets started to, perhaps, impress upon the party the need for stealth, or (as I suggested) as a minor last note for each room.

But every eventuality for every space can't realistically be covered and shouldn't try to be.

A note in the preface DM material would be useful to this effect. Telling/noting/reminding them that the "dungeon" [whatever the location actually is] is not a static snapshot in time, but a living/breathing, perhaps also working/functional, space. That the DM can [and I would say "should"] have creatures moving about the space as the day progresses as makes sense for the location's internal workings, comings and goings. Then an example or two of what might/could happen there might be useful pointers. But fully fleshed out additional stats material is not necessary in those cases, I would say.

That's all. If the DM decides it's time for evening prayers, so all of the clerics from all of the room are now going to be heading to/gathering int he Main Chapel, then they can do that without being told what times that happens. If a guard rotation is, say, every 5 hours, they don't need to be told the times of day that will happen and bugbears might be in the halls going to or coming from "work." The DMs can decide if everything is status quo, as written, or things are in flux...unless, of course, you want to write the "flux" in as part of the adventure for whatever story/significant reasons.

 

[Charles Rampant]

One of my biggest complaints about running Hoard of the Dragon Queen is that it has loads of fantastical locations, meant presumably to evoke atmosphere, but it cannot be bothered giving me a description of those locations. A lack of boxed text is a lack of descriptions for me to read to the players, maybe adapting as I go; without one, the room is often tough to describe in a novel and fun way.

For example, underneath Naerytar Castle is a frog shrine. Room 11, page 61. I was able to adapt the first paragraph into boxed text on the fly. But then room 12, the inner sanctum of Pharblex, the Bullywug Priest? I came to this impossibly dense and long description, none of it boxed, and froze for ten seconds while I tried to parse it. Then I said, "uh, this is another big, rectangular room... it contains a mud-covered chair and reading table, a box of candles, and a wooden chest." You'll notice that this is from the end of the first paragraph. (The rest of the paragraph is devoted to a useless account of where Pharblex goes, as if this is Oblivion and the players are going to find him asleep if they hit the Rest button outside the room.) Then I paused again, trying to scan for any other information, which I couldn't find, so I just trailed off. The adventure devotes nearly a third of this entire page to describing how the trap on the chest works, and no space whatsoever to giving a description that would entice the players, let them work out that there is something on the ceiling to be aware of, or in general save me any effort when running it. This whole chapter is a great example, to be honest; apart from one picture, the players and DM get given basically no interesting or useful descriptive text to make the castle memorable beyond a bunch of combat encounters. It could be a white box filled with cultists and Rezmir's furniture, and it'd have the same effect.

If I look at an adventure now and see that it doesn't have boxed text, I'm likely to not bother buying or running it. It's a huge help when running, and indeed one of the things that I'd specifically want an adventure to help me with. One thing that I found difficult with running my own dungeons was the lack of it; I now had to extempore describe what was in a given room and why the players should care about it.

You asked about the changeable stuff; the best boxed text that I've seen has usually had a line above it saying, "Adapt the below if the players arrive at night" which, having been warned, is easy to do. They also tend to not describe the inhabitants of the room, instead letting you add that on in your own words after completing the boxed text I often also finish a boxed text by saying, "Remember that you guys enter by the north doorway, and the room is 40x30", the more mechanistic stuff that you don't want clogging up the description.

 

[ccs]

Some things I'd like....

A catchy title that applies to the adventure coupled with evocative art work on the cover. The cover of your module is essentially the poster of an action movie.

A compiled list of all the monsters used throughout the adventure. That way I can collect the needed minis/make tokens etc without combing through the adventure page by page.
Break it down by page & monsters appearing.
Ex; P.1: 5 kobolds. P.2: 3 kobolds, 2 zombies, 1 wolf etc etc etc.

Use monsters not often ever seen in play. Ex; When was the last time you encountered a Morkath?

Self contained. I need adventures that will cover 2-4 sessions (about 12-16 hrs)/1 lvs worth of play. NOT lv1-15+ long campaigns that'll take us most of a year (or more) to play.

Printable PDFs of the maps made so that 1 square = 1 inch when printed.

Encounters/traps/hazards that could very well kill a character of the expected lv your writing for, taking into account that there will be on average 4 characters present.
At least one of those 4 characters should be in real danger.

 

[Quickleaf]

[MENTION=32659]Charles Rampant[/MENTION] Thanks for the example, that really helps me better understand how the boxed text is useful to the DM. I never read Hoard of the Dragon Queen, so didn't realize it was so egregious in its muddled/hidden descriptions.

Here's an example of how I personally have tried to combine boxed text with dynamic elements, in this case a multi-tiered well with a different description depending on which dungeon level the PCs approach it...

[SECTION]Well
An open arch is inscribed with Ignan runes: Death begins in water and ends in fire. It leads to a cool quiet semicircular chamber 15’ (4.5 m) in diameter. At the center is an 8’ (2.5 m) diameter circular well accessed via four pointed arches arranged in the cardinal directions. A winch-operated chain hangs down the middle, connected to a bucket. A narrow 6” (15 cm) brick ledge spirals along the inside of the well.[/SECTION]
On the upper level…
[SECTION]The well is 60’ (18 m) deep before reaching water, with four pointed archways at about midway and four more archways at the bottom.[/SECTION]
On the main level…
[SECTION]The well is 30’ deep before reaching water, with four pointed archways at the bottom. The well’s shaft continues up for another 30’ (9 m) where there are four more archways at the top.[/SECTION]
On the lower level…
[SECTION]This is the base of the well, with a bucket floating on the cold dark water. The well’s shaft extends 60’ (18 m) up, with four pointed archways at about midway and four more archways at the top.[/SECTION]

[MENTION=92511]steeldragons[/MENTION] Terrific reply

Well, preferably, you could use a reference to the original page, as Lanefan suggested, ideally if they're in the same spread. I personally, wouldn't mind referencing the original page number if there are several of the same creature...but then you're defeating the purpose of "ease of use/having it there in front of you on the page you need it." Obviously, if there is a difference/change in the creature (beyond just hit points), if it's wearing different armor or using a magical two-handed sword with special abilities instead of a glaive or whatever, then it gets its own block again. But, I suppose, if it appears four times in four different spreads, then yeah...kinda stuck/you should print it again.

But saying "this is getting to be too much, so I'll shunt all of this other stuff, from EVERY room, and put it elsewhere in its own section" doesn't really solve the problem, does it? It's still page count. It's still material -which now the DM must be flipping back and forth with to check and incorporate.

I've run a few "zoo / fun house" type dungeons where this approach makes sense because you're hardly ever repeating the same enemy type twice and spellcasters were relatively rare.

However, if you have a stronghold of spellcasting cultists (er, pretty much my current scenario), then you have a compounded problem of recurring enemies with spells. Actually, innate spellcasting & spellcasting occur frequently enough in 5e for this to be an issue. And your page count increases significantly if you include multiple instances of monsters like...

Oni: Large giant LE; AC 16; HP 110; Saves Str +4, Dex +3, Con +6, Int +2, Wis +4, Cha +5; #Att 2 glaive, Large +7 (10 ft), 2d10+4 slashing / Medium +7 (5 ft) 1d10+4 slashing; Spd 30, fly 30; Senses 14 (darkvision 60 ft); Lang common, giant; Special change shape, magic weapons, regeneration (10), Innate Spells (save DC 13)

At will: darkness, invisibility
1/day: charm person, sleep, gaseous form, cone of cold​

CR 7 (2,900 XP); Monster Manual 239.

Flame Mage: Medium humanoid any evil; AC 14 (with mage armor); HP 38; Spd 30; Senses 15; Lang common, ignan, jhatab’enar; Resist fire; Saves Str +0, Dex +1, Con +1, Int +6, Wis +5, Cha +0; #Att 1 fire bolt +6 (120 ft), 2d10 fire; dagger +4 (5 ft), 3 (1d4+1) piercing; Special geased; Spells (save DC 14, attack +6)

cantrips control flames (EE), fire bolt, light, mage hand;
1st (4) burning hands, detect magic, mage armor;
2nd (3) flaming sphere, scorching ray, suggestion;
3rd (3) dispel magic, fireball, haste;
4th (1) wall of fire;​

CR 6 (2,300 XP); p. #.

 

[Quickleaf]

A compiled list of all the monsters used throughout the adventure. That way I can collect the needed minis/make tokens etc without combing through the adventure page by page.
Break it down by page & monsters appearing.
Ex; P.1: 5 kobolds. P.2: 3 kobolds, 2 zombies, 1 wolf etc etc etc.

I do something similar when prepping an adventure. Earlier, I'd floated the idea of a "Monster Index" with abbreviated stat blocks which [MENTION=29398]Lanefan[/MENTION] soundly rejected because it would involve ANY amount of page-flipping.

But it sounds like there's a middle ground, where you have the abbreviated stat blocks in the text, and then the "Monster Index" just gives you page-by-page lists of monster types and #s?

Printable PDFs of the maps made so that 1 square = 1 inch when printed.

Is that common practice? I haven't seen many recent adventures do that, and certainly it was not common practice back in AD&D.

My sense is, outside of a Mike Schley or other cartographers employed by WotC, that what you're asking for really isn't done because it's an added expense which would mean higher markup on the adventure's price.

 

[Charles Rampant]

Happy to help! For your reference, and to help anyone following along, this is what the page in question looks like.

On the other topic, I really don't mind the standard 5e model of monster names being Bold for reference to Volo's or the MM; but then I tend to pre-build all of the combats in a combat tracker on my iPad, so it's actually helpful to be able to read through the rooms and just note down the bold names. Page flipping is inevitable in RPGs - the moment your dungeon is longer than two pages long including map, it's going to involve page flipping - and efficient usage of space is not something that I associate with in-room combat descriptions. Lich Queen's Beloved, to refer to the other thread, can be a bit of a chore at times with page-long statblocks given longform in the text; it makes it a bit tough to work out what's in the room otherwise. Others seem to really want inline descriptions; I'm not sure I see the benefit unless that monster never reappears, or you're going for the 3e combat summary style mentioned by Shoak1.